U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Internet Gambling- WTO rules against USA-

U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case-





WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States has suffered a new setback in a four-year-old legal battle with Antigua and Barbuda over U.S. restrictions on Internet gambling, a U.S. trade official said on Thursday.
At issue is an April 2005 World Trade Organisation ruling against U.S. prohibitions on online horse race betting. Since then, the U.S. Congress has passed additional legislation to ban betting over the Internet.

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Gretchen Hamel, a spokesman for the U.S. Trade Representative's office, confirmed press reports that a WTO panel "did not agree with the United States that we had taken the necessary steps to comply" with that ruling.


At the same time, Hamel downplayed the decision contained in a preliminary, confidential report to the two parties.

"The panel's findings issued today involve a narrow issue of federal law" and the United States will have opportunity to submit comments to the WTO before it issues its final, public report in March, Hamel said.

"Nothing in the panel's interim report undermines the broad, favourable results that the United States obtained from the WTO in April 2005," she said.
The issue is a touchy one for the Bush administration, which supports free trade but whose conservative allies in Congress pushed through a bill late last year to ban most forms of Internet gambling.


Antigua and Barbuda, with few natural resources, has sought to build up an Internet gambling industry to provide jobs to replace those in its declining tourist industry.

It argued in a case first brought to the WTO in 2003 that U.S. laws barring the placing of bets across states lines by electronic means violated WTO rules.

An April 2005 ruling by the WTO's Appellate Body, which both sides claimed as vindication, focussed on the narrower issue of horse racing, saying that foreign betting operators appeared to suffer discrimination.
Antigua and Barbuda complained the United States had not complied with the decision and the WTO agreed in July 2006 to look into the matter, resulting in the ruling on Thursday.



The United States will decide after the final panel decision ruling in March whether to appeal.

The Bush administration may not have to ask Congress to pass new legislation in any case, Hamel said.
"The panel report clarifies that compliance does not necessarily require new legislation, but could instead involve other steps, such as administrative or judicial action," she said.
 

dirty

EOG Master
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

so I am not confused...what is this saying....that the US has til march to Justify their actions of the last few months before the final ruling against the Government...instead of just the few member panel
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

i hope this is good news....the witch hunt needs to stop
 

NickPappagiorgio

EOG Dedicated
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

For some reason I dont think the US cares about what the rest of the world thinks, etc. Will the WTO be able to overrule the US law?
 

devilmann

EOG Addicted
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

For some reason I dont think the US cares about what the rest of the world thinks, etc. Will the WTO be able to overrule the US law?

I agree ... for good or bad, depending on the issue or your perspective our government seems to do what ever it wants with little thought to the rest of the world.
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Yeah, the only repercussion that I could think of is the WTO basically telling the U.S. that if you don't want to listen to us on the gambling issue, then we're going to continue to let those offshore mp3 sites selling songs for a penny a piece to continue to go on.

Would never happen, as I doubt the WTO sees two wrongs making a right, but it sure would be funny... I imagine the lobbyists involved in the movie and music industry could trump those in the gambling industry.
 

dirty

EOG Master
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

If copyright laws are not followed around the world it will cripple the Movie and Music Industry...Especially the Music industry as they are surviving off of MP3 sales now.... Not one CD store is open in my City now....We have Recycled CDs but it is does not sale new stores...Blockbuster Music, Starship, etc...all closed down a couple of years ago... Once it hits those industries in the pocket books we may have a shot.
 
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The Devil

EOG Master
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

IT WILL BE FUN TO WATCH.......THE GAMBLING BAN, WHILE SHUTTING DOWN A LOT OF THINGS IS ACTUALLY HURTING THE WORLDS ECONOMY...........HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE LOST JOBS OR WILL LOSE THEM???? HOW MUCH REVENUE WILL BE LOST DUE TO GAMBLING TRANSACTIONS BEING STOPPED???????HOW MUCH WAS LOST IN STOCK PRICES???????

THINK MAYBE 20% OF OFF SHORE GAMING JOBS HAVE BEEN LOST ALREADY???? WHAT WILL NETELLERS LOSS BE?????

YEP, IT MAY GET INTERESTING IF ANTIGUA STARTS SELLING MOVIES AND MUSIC CHEAP..........
 

dirty

EOG Master
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

don't forget software...Microsoft pretty much runs the Non Business Computer world and some of it...
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Its nice to have in the industry's pocket, but come on like the US is going to pay attention to it. They have ignored the WTO before and only passed a few laws to actually conform to it. Politician will just bitch about being told what to do isn't American and then pass the laws they wish.

It sure hasn't made the DOJ pause.
 

dirty

EOG Master
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

But the DOJ or Congress has never had a ruling like this over thier heads either.... everything has always been in the appeals process...it will be interesting to see what happens
 

auditor

EOG Senior Member
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Anything that brings this issue out in the open is good for us.

We have the majority of people not wanting prohibition. There are millions of Americans that gamble online. If 25% of us contacted congress this law would be dead. But for some reason, we as gamblers and webmasters can't get together in large numbers.

APCW has had conversations with several congressmen; and we are working on some political alliances, but we have no political weight as an industry. We don't have the numbers. Who will stand up and say something? The casinos/sportbooks will not help lobby, they are too scared. So are we going to sit back and let the WTO fight our fight for us, which has been going on for years?,

Party Poker alone had millions of US players. Party Poker contacted all their US players and put a link to the Poker Players Alliance on their front page, telling them to join to protect their right to play. The Poker Players Alliance has only 150,000 members. Now maybe it was the fact they charge $20 and people didn't want to part with money. This lack of support is why poker couldn't get an exemption.

APCW has thousands of people watch our weekly webcast and had over 50,000 watch our political videos, but only 400 are members.
I know we can make a difference if we fight for our freedoms. If we had the numbers we can effect change.

JOIN THE FIGHT to save online gambling. JOIN FOR FREE.
We can bitch about Pinnacle and Neteller, or come together and do something. If we can get numbers together we will change this law.

The Association of Players, Casinos, and Webmasters - APCW.org
 

Dante

EOG Veteran
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

my opinion on this is


it might have been good news if the DOJ and the FEDS gave 2 shits about the WTO....but they do not they could not give a rats ass about them...they listen to NOONE and our gov will do what they want to who they want when they want

sad stuff and times we live in only hope is that our congress introduces a bill one day to do away with this nonsense ...but that might be a LONGGGGGGGGGGGGG way off


my 2 cents
 

The General

Another Day, Another Dollar
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

We have the majority of people not wanting prohibition. There are millions of Americans that gamble online. If 25% of us contacted congress this law would be dead. But for some reason, we as gamblers and webmasters can't get together in large numbers.

I concur and I don't know if it is laziness, fright or lack of real care. We must keep in mind that the VAST majority of gamblers are losers and in some way I wonder that deep down they do not wish to fight as they would be fighting to continue and lose money. They can continue to lose in other legal ways also. I wish we knew the exact numbers of gamblers who really wrote anything to their legislators sharing displeasure prior to the gambling bill even leaving the House. Not to mention I now know many more riverboat junkies than sports bettors in my personal life. And maybe horse bettors too. These options supply them their fix with less hassle and worry.
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Guys,

I wouldn't minimize this decision. If the US ignores the WTO's FINAL decision (by the way, if the US appeals it should only buy them an additional 60 days), then the WTO has the POWER to IMPOSE some SERIOUS TRADE SANCTIONS against the United States...

In a time where we are perceived as the biggest bullies in the World, it is my opinion that the US will be forced to comply or suffer major consequences..

Perhaps JC can elaborate more...

THE SHRINK
 

Bucsfan67

EOG Master
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Guys,

I wouldn't minimize this decision. If the US ignores the WTO's FINAL decision (by the way, if the US appeals it should only buy them an additional 60 days), then the WTO has the POWER to IMPOSE some SERIOUS TRADE SANCTIONS against the United States...

In a time where we are perceived as the biggest bullies in the World, it is my opinion that the US will be forced to comply or suffer major consequences..

Perhaps JC can elaborate more...

THE SHRINK


lets hope your right...

Like we said before, AT LEAST its a start....:thumbsup
 

NickPappagiorgio

EOG Dedicated
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Will this ruling, if all appeals are lost, make it harder for the US to arrest sportsbook owners, etc.? If they cant make anymore arrests after the rulings, things may get easier.
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

all i can say is!!!!! atleast the wto is sounding the alarm!!

the more noise the better!! :thumbsup
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

I love it!! This is an awesome way to start the weekend!!
 

MoneyManager

EOG Enthusiast
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

It's true we, the U.S., is already perceived as a world Bully. Now we are making moves that negatively effect those that are our world friends --- jobs lost, stock market devaluation. In fact to add more insult, our own "powers that be" are even passing laws against what is polled to be a non-issue for 90%+ American voters. That will loose you support even at home --- it's not rocket science, that's why they take polls.

This is the kind of stuff that causes power to change hands --- i.e. our last elections. You can debate Reps. vs Dems. all you want but this was a dead issue except for a very few Republicians that greased it up and slipped it in. The main issue voted on and passed was about Port Security not gambling.
The gambling stuff had been stopped before thru lack of support.

The gambling part effects more people directly than Port security part.

If you, as an individual, look up and something you are doing is pissing off even your friends, its time to change your attitude and actions. Its the same with nations. I haven't seen this much high and mighty "I know more than you do!" since the Vietnam War days. The polls show it ---- lowest confidence rating since Tricky Dick Nixon.

Something will change, hopefully for the better.
 

Cobbler

EOG Addicted
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Party Poker alone had millions of US players. Party Poker contacted all their US players and put a link to the Poker Players Alliance on their front page, telling them to join to protect their right to play. The Poker Players Alliance has only 150,000 members. Now maybe it was the fact they charge $20 and people didn't want to part with money. This lack of support is why poker couldn't get an exemption.

150,000 x $20= $3,000,000. That's doing pretty good for an organization less than a year old. The question I have is what are they doing with that money.
 

auditor

EOG Senior Member
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

150,000 x $20= $3,000,000. That's doing pretty good for an organization less than a year old. The question I have is what are they doing with that money.

Damn good question...
 

Woody

EOG Veteran
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Guys,

I wouldn't minimize this decision. If the US ignores the WTO's FINAL decision (by the way, if the US appeals it should only buy them an additional 60 days), then the WTO has the POWER to IMPOSE some SERIOUS TRADE SANCTIONS against the United States...

Once the US gets to this point they will likely negotiate with Antigua, outside the WTO, same as they did with Canada over lumber. Canada had won the right to submit to WTO trade sanctions on the US.

The way the negotiations start is that Antgua will be added to the list of countries, including Cuba, that US citizens are not able to visit. But to avoid this and in recognition of lost gaming revenue the US will make a one time payment of $1,000,000 to Antigua. Whatever the negotiations are the US plays hardball and dirty. Wait and see.
 

devilmann

EOG Addicted
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Once the US gets to this point they will likely negotiate with Antigua, outside the WTO, same as they did with Canada over lumber. Canada had won the right to submit to WTO trade sanctions on the US.

The way the negotiations start is that Antgua will be added to the list of countries, including Cuba, that US citizens are not able to visit. But to avoid this and in recognition of lost gaming revenue the US will make a one time payment of $1,000,000 to Antigua. Whatever the negotiations are the US plays hardball and dirty. Wait and see.


I would tend to agree. Their will probably be some type of backdoor deal where we make a payment in lew of compensation and revenue lost to gaming. There will probably also be stipulations on the U.S. pushing tourism to these countries to make up for this loss.

It will be similar to an "out of court settlement."
 

Ace

EOG Veteran
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

who are the sports books based in Antigua
 

JC

EOG Veteran
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

If it was about money, Antigua could have gotten a settlement years ago. Antiguans are a very proud people. It's about sovereignty.

I hope there is a settlement in the end, but not just a cash settlement.
 
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Pride is one thing, but governments are all about money...

As the saying goes...everyone has a price...
 

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Pride is one thing, but governments are all about money...

As the saying goes...everyone has a price...

And I think that last sentence explains WHY the terrorists hate the US.
 

NickPappagiorgio

EOG Dedicated
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

And I think that last sentence explains WHY the terrorists hate the US.

Theres actually a much bigger reason why the terrorists hate the US. Although that may be the reason the rest of the world hates the US.
 

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

Theres actually a much bigger reason why the terrorists hate the US. Although that may be the reason the rest of the world hates the US.

The terrorists are simply the extremist amoung the world. Most of them from the oil rich area of the world.
 

sean1

EOG Dedicated
Re: U.S. confirms loss in Internet gambling trade case

The US is not going to ban travelers from Antigua. That will not fly. The country as a whole hated Cuba. Even the US gov wont say those bastards in Antigua gamble - you can't go there.

The US will likely try to make a payoff.

It will be up to Antigua as to whether they take the money or keep up the good fight.

I personally hope they win the rights not to protect US copyrights and patents.

Sean
 
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