Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Sound of Silence

Sound of Silence

2
Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue

February 26, 2007

Although things have appeared bleak lately for Americans who enjoy online gambling, something is about to happen next month which may swing the pendulum back towards freedom of choice.

Laws passed previously banned non-US companies from operating in the US gaming market.

However, Antigua and Barbuda had built up a significant Internet gambling industry to replace falling tourist revenue and took the US to the The World Trade Organization (WTO).

Antigua argued that this was an illegal trade restriction, claiming it broke a free trade pact that the US had signed.

The World Trade Organization (WTO) has ruled against the US in an online gambling dispute with the Caribbean island of Antigua and Barbuda.

Although the ruling is still private, it's been reported that the WTO has found the US guilty of not complying with a 2005 order in the case.

More alarming is the fact that this information was deliberately leaked by the United States despite a stern warning from the WTO to keep this information privileged until an official report was to be released in March of 2007.

Many uninformed individuals don't believe this particular victory will change anything. In fact, they are the first to point out that the United States has taken a more drastic approach recently by citing some examples.

Last October, the US passed laws which made almost all Internet gambling illegal in the US and several online gambling executives have been held by US authorities. The latest blow occurred when two of the co-founders of Neteller were arrested in January.

In a time when the US has been ordered to comply, their actions have been quite the opposite. They have acted like arrogant bullies because they believe they can get away with it.

Well, for starters, they tried this with Iraq and look at where that got us?

Don't underestimate the WTO and in particular, Antigua's commitment to drastically change the course of recent events. When an economy like Antigua depends so much on Internet gambling, wouldn't you naturally expect them to fight for their lives? And let's not forget they have the "law" on their side, too.

Finally, to those who don't believe Antigua can stop the US from ignoring the WTO's ruling, I beg to differ. One example of how Antigua can fight back is to attack America where it hurts most, in their wallets. It's been said that Antigua can make movies available for basically "peanuts" so that Americans could theoretically purchase their favorite DVD'S and other products for a dollar a piece.

Do you think that might get the attention of some people, including all of Hollywood?

Of course it would!

Therefore, although the Internet gambling industry had faced many hurdles, the one conclusion that can be drawn at this time is it isn't going anywhere.

And dare I say the United States is about to lose another battle? Only this time, innocent people won't end up being killed fighting a war that cannot be won.

-- by Kenneth Weitzner (EOG.com)
 
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RealSlimShady

RealSlimShady

EOG Dedicated
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Forget gambling....I'm getting into the DVD duplicating business! :houra :dancefool
 
NickPappagiorgio

NickPappagiorgio

EOG Dedicated
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Excellent read, right up to the point you made your politcal statement. I am one of the non-believers. I hope a little country like Antigua can win this battle, but I will believe it when I see it.
 
S

stef

EOG Enthusiast
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Go Antigua. But really when has this F-UP government of ours ever listen to anything they don't want to hear. Interesting article by Kennith. On second thought maybe they will listen when money is invovled cause they sure don't care about our young men and women of arms.
 
Woody

Woody

EOG Veteran
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

The WTO penalty phase is as drawn out as the arbitration but finally this is going somewhere.

If Antigua starts supplying other entertainment products, in violation of US copyright, I fully expect the DOJ to get courts orders freezing Antigua's assets within the US and restricting consumer payments to Antiguan companies. The US plays hardball and knows how to fight a trade war!
 
Cobbler

Cobbler

EOG Addicted
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

A Neteller clone really needs to open up in Antigua.
 
THE SHRINK

THE SHRINK

1
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Woody said:
The WTO penalty phase is as drawn out as the arbitration but finally this is going somewhere.

If Antigua starts supplying other entertainment products, in violation of US copyright, I fully expect the DOJ to get courts orders freezing Antigua's assets within the US and restricting consumer payments to Antiguan companies. The US plays hardball and knows how to fight a trade war!
Click to expand...

What I am hearing from ANTIGUA'S side is that they are VERY prepared...
 
devilmann

devilmann

EOG Addicted
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

I hope you are right about this Shrink. I must say that I tend to agree with Woody's statment and am fairly pessimistic that the US will lay down here.
 
THE SHRINK

THE SHRINK

1
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

I don't blame ANYONE for ebing skeptical bu when you are sprayed with lace, you won't continue to lie down, guaranteed!
 
W

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

How's the cost / standard of living in Antigua as compared to various areas of the US?
 
1

-105

2
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Cobbler said:
A Neteller clone really needs to open up in Antigua.
Click to expand...

now,
you boy's have heard about that "New Improved Just Add Money neteller" right? the are calling it youteller.

yea,
I think the only way you guys should ever use this thing is to 1st let us offshore guys try it out just to be shre that the withdrawal bottons work properly. And 2nd, only leave lose change in there every transaction you ever make.


hope that helps
-105
 
M

muskatel

EOG Addicted
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Shrink, I have to say that if this is the good news expected in March - I don't want to hear any bad news.

:(

The US Government and US Banking aren't going to change anything due to the WTO or Antiqua. The government will state that the flow of funds to Antiqua violates some terrorism law that currently exists - or will exist next week. The Senate can have some anti-banking act in place before Britney Spears checks out of rehab.

I thought your article's a) $1 video threat and b) anti-Iraq opine detracted from the pro-internet gambling 'good news' article's focus.

As you mentioned, the reader (me) may be underestimating Antiqua and the WTO. I guess I will believe it when I see it. When Neteller releases funds (which I imagine also should fall under the Antiqu and WTO news umbrella); when Pinny opens up shop; when investors can bet again - then I'm on board.

Most importantly - I appreciate all of the efforts and communication you provide to the readers.

Is there anybody else that believes this is good news?

:rolleyes:
 
P

professor 08

EOG Member
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

The US has one more appeal. Which brings us into the Summer.

What this means is if the US does not allow internet gambling, then Antigua gets to ignore all US patents and trade marks.

Forget movies, that's a little bit of gravy on the feast. Think for a moment. Let's see, Microsoft would go bankrupt in exactly how long??? Or lets say you own an engineering company. A rival company spent $5 billion and 5 years creating the nut product and patenting it. Oh well, let's open up a corp in Antigua. Hmm saved all that R&D. Sets them back I would say. Pharmaceticals, ouch that one hurts. Does the US economy get crushed? Do they fold their hand? Do they go to war? Do they buy Antigua out?

All possible options. Lets hope Antigua does not roll over and take the cash.
 
W

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

I wish Antigua ALL THE BEST
But where do they keep the oil buried that Iraq has!
 
W

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

What I REALLY don't understand is why other Countries (Costa Rica and The United Kingdom, don't stand up WITH Antigua)
 
1

-105

2
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

true whos on 1st,
I am not an evengelist or preacher either boy's but like I have been saying get Your new offshore company with account w and convenient banking at any atm on the planet via worldcard card, all set up, it is the only way to fly right now for you U.S. boy's safely.

I have used it for years with no problem ever shall we have a little demonstration how it works?


sharp
105
 
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THE SHRINK

THE SHRINK

1
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

professor 08 said:
The US has one more appeal. Which brings us into the Summer.

What this means is if the US does not allow internet gambling, then Antigua gets to ignore all US patents and trade marks.

Forget movies, that's a little bit of gravy on the feast. Think for a moment. Let's see, Microsoft would go bankrupt in exactly how long??? Or lets say you own an engineering company. A rival company spent $5 billion and 5 years creating the nut product and patenting it. Oh well, let's open up a corp in Antigua. Hmm saved all that R&D. Sets them back I would say. Pharmaceticals, ouch that one hurts. Does the US economy get crushed? Do they fold their hand? Do they go to war? Do they buy Antigua out?

All possible options. Lets hope Antigua does not roll over and take the cash.
Click to expand...

EXCELLENT POST!!!

And let's not forget BODOG has moved to ANTIGUA and Calvin is no dummy...

I suspect he wants to be on the WINNING SIDE...

My money is on our industry getting stronger in the near future and eventually, the US will be FORCED to realize they cannot stop it, nor can they allocate enough funds to continue their assault.

Many Republican Americans who enjoy gambling did NOT vote REPUBLICAN this last election because of this issue, period. And I do believe some KEY people in Washington get it!
 
trytrytry

trytrytry

All I do is trytrytry
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

please please please tell us that this was not the good news you were promissing last week?
 
M

muskatel

EOG Addicted
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Shrink,

What does the good news mean to Joe Sixpack?

Does this WTO/Antiqua effect Neteller customers getting their money back?

Do you have an rough estimate on a timeline when US citizens can wager from Antiqua businesses? 3 month, 6 month, 1-year - I'm just trying to get an idea of what you envision happening with this breaking WTO news. On paper I admit it should be very favorable to the gambling industry.

Thanks.
 
trytrytry

trytrytry

All I do is trytrytry
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

thanks shrink I mean Im all for Antuiga and all but realy we need a major pick me up soon!
 
THE SHRINK

THE SHRINK

1
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

muskatel,

1-It means that Internet gambling will become safer and more convenient to use in the future for Joe sixpack. Although these are clearly the hardest of times the industry has ever faced, I believe we will see sunshine as we move out of this tunnel.

2-The WTO ruling against the USA should have no direct impact on Neteller. They are two completely different entities..

Do I believe US gamblers who have Neteller accounts will eventually get paid? Yes, I am cautiously optimistic...

3-I believe the EARLIEST timeline for meaningful changes to occur will be right before FOOTBALL begins this year...

THE SHRINK
 
zerocage

zerocage

2
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Will we ever be able to keep larger balances without thought?
 
Bagiant

Bagiant

EOG Dedicated
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

I would say that Calvin Ayres is a smart man. He just moved Bodog to Antiqua. Is there anything else to say?
 
WildBill

WildBill

2
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

stuckinvegas said:
I would say that Calvin Ayres is a smart man. He just moved Bodog to Antiqua. Is there anything else to say?
Click to expand...

Anything else to say? Hmm why did Calvin pull most US facing advertising?

You guys tell me this, if our political leaders go on the offensive and say the will of a country of 300 million people, the richest in the world, has been deemed less important than the will of a nation of 70,000 people on islands which combined are smaller than the city of Los Angeles, what is Joe Sixpack going to say? That's right "fuck those bastards". Our Congress has to act to change this because our President isn't going to have his agency do any policy bending for this. That would be admitting they lost at something and what are the chances of that?
 
THE SHRINK

THE SHRINK

1
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Here are the mechanisms that are in place.

For starters, the UNITED STATES won't have any say-so in announcing whether they have WON or LOST when the WTO releases it's decision next month.

In fact, the US already leaked that they LOST...

Now, the United States can APPEAL the decision, but it won't buy them much time because the APPEALS process will be over by the end of the SUMMER (90 days)...

Although there is a 95% chance that the US will appeal it, there is a slim possibility they won't. Here's why they may not...

The best analogy I can compare this to is taking a case from the District Court and appealing it to Circuit Court ( a higher entity). If you LOSE again in the Circuit Court, it sets a HIGHER PRECEDENT that can be used against you.

Therefore, if the UNITED STATES feels they have NO SHOT at WINNING its APPEAL, it would NOT be in its BEST INTEREST to taking it to a higher ground.

Now once the US has exhausted it's APPEAL process, the REMEDY PHASE officially begins which will in all likelihood occur at the end of the SUMMER (assuming the US appeals the decision in March)...

If ANTIGUA has to go to the REMEDY phase, it will wrap up by the end of the year!

THE SHRINK
 
CanuckKid

CanuckKid

2
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

Antigua is actually quite expensive to live unless of course your making "good" money (like over 6 figures US)
 
Woody

Woody

EOG Veteran
Re: Internet Gambling - Antigua to the Rescue, by THE SHRINK

professor 08 said:
Forget movies, that's a little bit of gravy on the feast. Think for a moment. Let's see, Microsoft would go bankrupt in exactly how long??? Or lets say you own an engineering company. A rival company spent $5 billion and 5 years creating the nut product and patenting it. Oh well, let's open up a corp in Antigua. Hmm saved all that R&D. Sets them back I would say. Pharmaceticals, ouch that one hurts. Does the US economy get crushed? Do they fold their hand? Do they go to war? Do they buy Antigua out?
Click to expand...

I understand the remedy phase would be limited to the entertainment sector, where the US is in non-compliance. Arts and entertainment, Microsoft ripoffs, engineering if it involves iPod type products but certainly not Pharmaceuticals.

Certainly a good move for Bodog to relocate there, given the government support, and from Calvin's comments, about expanding in the entertainment field, one could expect them to become a major supplier of WTO sanctioned products into the US market. When/if that happens this Canadian will need a US address!
 
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