Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Should The Jockey, Gabriel Saez, Who Rode The Filly, EIGHT BELLES, Be Suspended? :+clueless

I have my opinion which I will reserve for later....

Anyone?
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

For what? There has to be a reason for a suspension!
 
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Whatever good it will do, PETA is calling for the immediate suspension of Gabriel Saez until an inquiry can determine if Eight Belles? jockey used his whip too much down the stretch.

Many who saw replays of the the race witnessed the jockey continuing to WHIP THE FILLY many times after she has broken both her ankles.

That?s all in a letter PETA is sending to the Kentucky racing authority asking for sweeping reforms, including preventing horses as young as 3 years old from racing.

?I don?t think anything will be done right away,? said Guillermo. ?But I don?t think many people who watch racing want to see a horse lying dead in the dirt.?

This is at least the second high-profile breakdown in two years at a Triple Crown race. But for all the outpouring of sentiment Barbaro received after breaking an ankle at the 2006 Preakness, nobody seemed ready to attribute these sorts of injuries to animal cruelty
 

patswin

EOG Veteran
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

No and I can't believe the amount of press this story is getting. The jockey did nothing wrong, even the trainer said so. Why is the media making this such a big deal?
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

As posted in Glenn Danzig's special delivery thread...

Headlines | Posted 5/5/2008, 6:05 pm Eight Belles's injury rare and baffling

By GLENYE CAIN OAKFORD LEXINGTON, Ky. - Breakdowns of the kind Eight Belles sustained moments after the Kentucky Derby are unusual in horses that are pulling up from a race, equine orthopedic surgeons said Monday. But the strides after the finish line can still present a danger for tired horses.
There are two primary contributing factors for post-race breakdowns, said Dr. Larry Bramlage, an orthopedic surgeon with Rood and Riddle Equine Hospital who was present at the Derby as a veterinary spokesman from the American Association of Equine Practitioners.
"One, they're tired, so their muscles absorb less of the stress, so they start taking a heavier load on the skeleton," said Bramlage. "The second thing is, they take their mind off what they're doing. That's why you want a jockey to let the horse gallop out over a longer distance and don't let them start propping to slow themselves down. The propping situation certainly wouldn't apply here, because the horse had galloped out already a quarter of a mile easing down in speed. As to whether she was tired or not, she'd just run a mile and a quarter - they're all tired.
"You'll see things like condylar fractures or sesamoid fractures in one leg, and as they start slowing down and their mind gets off of the competition, they'll become aware of the discomfort," Bramlage added when asked what injuries are most likely after the finish line. "An injury as they're pulling up is not terribly unheard of. The vast majority of injuries, however, don't manifest until they're cooling out, unless the horse becomes structurally unstable in some fashion. Then they start slowing down in the race. None of those scenarios fit here."
Bramlage said close examination of video shows Eight Belles's breakdown began when her right front leg failed.
"Two steps later, her left front gives way as well, and that's when she went down," he said. "She gets very asymmetric [uneven in stride] for about two steps, and then her left front fails."
That progression has led some to believe the filly's shifting weight from the right front to the left front likely contributed to the left leg's failure. She had condylar fractures, vertical breaks from the fetlock area up into the cannon bone, in both forelegs.
Dwayne H. Rodgerson, a surgeon at Hagyard Equine Medical Institute, called Eight Belles's injury - near-simultaneous catastrophic condylar fractures in both forelegs - "very rare."
Rodgerson said he knows of no statistics showing how many injuries occur after the finish line. But studies have shown the catastrophic injury rate in Thoroughbred races typically hovers between 1.6 and 2.03 per 1,000 races.
Smaller condylar fractures occur fairly commonly in racehorses and frequently can be repaired. Rodgerson said that horses with more common incomplete condylar fractures often are weight bearing and can appear sound. But the rarer severe cases, particularly ones in which bone breaks completely and through the skin and allows contamination into the leg, as happened on Eight Belles's left foreleg, can call for euthanasia.
"Once the bone pops out, it goes up the leg, and once that goes the collateral ligament support is gone," Rodgerson said. "The collateral ligament is what keeps the leg from shifting to the inside or outside, and when they lose that collateral ligament, the joint's not stable, and it can, in a sense, dislocate."
In Eight Belles's instance, the involvement of both front legs left no real option for treatment, Bramlage and Rodgerson agreed, because there was essentially no way for the horse to stand, a key to survival. And the open wound on the left front would have made the risk of infection high, even if surgeons had attempted repair.
Eight Belles's injury, and particularly the failure of both front fetlocks, provides a highly unusual and baffling case study for the country's top equine orthopedic surgeons.
"I've never seen it in a horse that galloped out that far after the race," Bramlage said. "I actually have only ever seen it firsthand on videotape and never in a race where I actually have been. Even in that situation and in situations where a horse injures one leg, they're not performing like she was performing. She was closing the gap at the end of the race, so it's not as if she were protecting something or aware, even, that anything was going on. Her level of performance couldn't have been higher. So there was no outward sign that any of this was impending."
Jockey did everything right, Jones says
Larry Jones, the trainer of Eight Belles, spoke out Monday in defense of jockey Gabriel Saez, who rode Eight Belles in the Kentucky Derby.
"This filly in every race has tried to drift toward the rail," Jones told The Associated Press in Lexington, Ky. "It's her comfort zone, and Gabriel knows this. This kid made every move the right move, and I hate it that they're wanting to jump down his throat. He did not try to abuse that horse to make her run faster. He knew he was second best, that she wasn't going to catch Big Brown."
People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, an animal rights group, has called for Saez to be suspended, suggesting that he should have known that the filly was injured.
Saez, 20, began to ride competitively in 2006 and was the youngest jockey in the Derby this year. He issued the following statement Monday from his home base at Delaware Park:
"I remain heartbroken over Eight Belles, and I want to let her many fans know that she never gave me the slightest indication before or during the race that there was anything bothering her. All I could sense under me was how eager she was to race. I was so proud of her performance, and of the opportunity to ride her in my first Kentucky Derby, all of which adds to my sadness. Riding right now at Delaware Park and being around the horses and other jockeys is good therapy for me, but I hope the media understands that I prefer not to conduct interviews at this time. Please respect my decision while I mourn my personal loss."
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

So I ask you again, Shrink, for what reason?
 
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

No....get over this bullshit and move on!!

Damn near caused a riot at our cottage this weekend....

It's a freaking horse....no one gave a shit about this horse when they were running the shit out her everyday.

FACE IT!! IT'S A BRUTAL SPORT.....

Guys are getting their ankles blown off everyday in the middle east and we are worried about a horse.
 

raycabino

Long Live Wilson!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

I could be missing something but I don't see any reason for Saez to be suspended.
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

I could be missing something but I don't see any reason for Saez to be suspended.

You're not missing anything, Ray, I've asked Shrink twice what is the reason for Saez to be suspended and so far he has declined to answer(which is a pretty good answer in itself, ie. there is NO reason for Saez to be suspended)
 

The General

Another Day, Another Dollar
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

I have seen nothing that would have me lean toward any suspension.
 

jwunderdog

EOG Addicted
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Does anyone really think a Jockey is going to try to make a lame horse go faster and increasing the chance the jockey gets hurt? PETA is becoming the fucking AL Sharpton of the animal world.
 

patswin

EOG Veteran
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Media should let this story die not continue to give it time. Its a stupid point, they don't like racing
 

winkyduck

TYVM Morgan William!!!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

NO

I think PETA should be taken out back and WHIPPED!
 

OMNIVOROUS FROG

EOG Master
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

I warned you guys about this. I am still maintaining it is a coin flip in the ignorant public's eyes. This is the way boycotts get started, legislation gets proposed. You remember who pushed the Mike Vick fiasco until they could push no more. This is a way bigger story than who won the race. And the media is running with it as well. Everyone here knows that it is part of racing, but peta needs a convenient scapegoat. Who else? The owners who chose to run the filly? Churchill Downs who had the race that the filly broke down in? The trainer? Someone has to fall in the blame game. What's really going to get racing is a death of another jockey in a high profile race, or a real graphic horse injury and death. Should the jockey be suspended? Of course not, he was not negligent in any manner. But peta needs someone.

Best Wishes...oF :+whipping
 
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Horse racing and dog racing are evil. We do not need to be involving other animals to feed our appetite for gambling.
 

OMNIVOROUS FROG

EOG Master
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Not sure evil, but no doubt a form of animal abuse, per definition. These horses bleed, suffer major injuries, even death. Just for our entertainment and wagering pleasures. Is it wrong? I don't know, I'm not a judge. But I still support it, and would support cockfighting, dog racing as well. This is a tough issue no doubt. But there is a lot of baggage injuring, maiming and killing animals for our recreation.

Best Wishes...oF :smokesmal
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

I warned you guys about this. I am still maintaining it is a coin flip in the ignorant public's eyes.

You are NOT still maintaining it is a coin flip in the ignorant public's eyes, you originally said...

Originally Posted by OMNIVOROUS FROG
We as horse bettors and gamblers look at this position as idiotic, but a lot of public people and horse lovers are on the other side of this coin flip.

...let me reiterate, this is NOT a coin flip. This is an idiotic position(that the jockey of Eight Belles should be suspended) by PETA. The only ignorance is displayed not by the public, but by the Obnoxious Frog.
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Should The Jockey, Gabriel Saez, Who Rode The Filly, EIGHT BELLES, Be Suspended? :+clueless

I have my opinion which I will reserve for later....

Anyone?

Still waiting, Shrink....you know how I value your opinion! Perhaps at that time you'll also answer my simple question. ie. for what reason?
 
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

pioneer,

thats redundant...

No, I dont believe he should be suspended..

THE SHRINK
 

The Devil

EOG Master
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

OF COURSE NOT...............IF HE EVEN SENSED THE HORSE WAS HURT HE WOULD HAVE PULLED HER UP AS SOON AS POSSIBLE............

THEY ARE HORSEMEN..........THEY EARN THEIR LIVING RIDING HORSES......AND 8 BELLS WAS A GOOD MEAL TICKET....................
 

Flamingo kid

Everybody's hands go UP!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

LOL...see post #2....but now Shrink declares that is redundant....maybe Shrink and JJ can share a dictionary

Oops, sorry for asking why, i just read the original post and responded, i didn't read others responses.

silly me for asking why :doh1
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Oops, sorry for asking why, i just read the original post and responded, i didn't read others responses.

silly me for asking why :doh1

How arrogant can you be? Elitists like The Shrink and his hero, BHO, don't have to answer questions from the Hoi Polloi
 

Almost Allright

GO Bucks!!!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

No way should the jockey be suspended. I told a friend after the race...well there is fodder for the PETA gang. I was only joking but i guess there are no limits for some of these "support groups"

I have even heard cries for the whip to be banned.
 
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Flamingo kid

Everybody's hands go UP!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

No way should the jockey be suspended. I told a friend after the race...well there is fodder for the PITA gang. I was only joking but i guess there are no limits for some of these "support groups"

I have even heard cries for the whip to be banned.

The racing industry or the jockey guild should come to this jock's defense and speak out against Peta.
 

Almost Allright

GO Bucks!!!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

The racing industry or the jockey guild should come to this jock's defense and speak out against Peta.


true. this is just another big stage for PETA to do their shit. If PETA really cared, wouldn't they be protesting BEFORE the race? Typical grandstanding.
 

Flamingo kid

Everybody's hands go UP!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

true. this is just another big stage for PETA to do their shit. If PETA really cared, wouldn't they be protesting BEFORE the race? Typical grandstanding.

Exactly. I think of the Macbeth quote when i think of Peta (people eating tasty animals)

?It is a tale ? full of sound and fury; signifying nothing.?
 

IGAMBLER

EOG Addicted
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Sentiment is against PETA in this matter. I have yet to see even one post in support of PETA, and for good reason.
 

Flamingo kid

Everybody's hands go UP!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Sentiment is against PETA in this matter. I have yet to see even one post in support of PETA, and for good reason.

PETA is coming after the racing industry but that industry cares DEEPLY about the animals and there are thousands of passionate, hard working people who are up at the butt crack of dawn 7 days a week putting their heart and soul into that game and into the care of those animals.

ESPN horse racing commentator Randy Moss said that Racing's dirty little secret is that the horses are treated better than the humans.
 
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

You can't be killing horses before national TV audiences.

Eight Belles goes down. Barbaro goes down.

Thousands of viewers watch this crap because they are told there are only like three important annual horseraces in their lives.

Horseracing, despite even the vig, is a bad all-around deal, for gamblers and horses.
 

Flamingo kid

Everybody's hands go UP!
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

You can't be killing horses before national TV audiences.

Eight Belles goes down. Barbaro goes down.

Thousands of viewers watch this crap because they are told there are only like three important annual horseraces in their lives.

Horseracing, despite even the vig, is a bad all-around deal, for gamblers and horses.

It happens... and if you are watching, you are supposed to know that. These horses are competing very hard out there on the playing field, whoever thinks there will never be an accident or tragedy is just fooling themselves.
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

You can't be killing horses before national TV audiences.

Eight Belles goes down. Barbaro goes down.

Thousands of viewers watch this crap because they are told there are only like three important annual horseraces in their lives.

Horseracing, despite even the vig, is a bad all-around deal, for gamblers and horses.

By all means then JJ, don't watch it. It just so happens that they had the 2nd largest crowd ever last week at the track(2nd only to the 100th running in 1974), and the largest TV ratings ever. But then since you're not watching, please spare us your asinine comments. Oh, that's right, you don't have to know anything about something in order to post about it. Carry on then, JJ, and I'll just do as I usually do then, ignore you. By the way, did you ever get that dictionary and/or brain?(evidently not)
 
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

No, he should not be suspended.

And, PETA is horrible.

I am sure the organization started out for a good cause. But somewhere along the way they became just like alot of organizations/protesters and "run" with whatever they can to be heard. It is sad that they are even taken seriously.

I wish more ppl shared my opinion about PETA. They will harp on an issue until something else comes along and them abandon their earlier protest. They are, for the most part, a group of ppl with a very closed mind, and too much time on their hands.
 

pioneer

EOG Dedicated
Re: Should The Jockey Who Rode 'Eight Belles' Be Suspended?

Jockey Club, NTRA Act on Derby Death
<!--Begin Article Tools-->

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<!--End Article Tools-->by Tom LaMarra
Date Posted: May 8, 2008
Last Updated: May 8, 2008


<TABLE style="BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" borderColor=#111111 cellPadding=2 width=50 align=left border=0 hspace="3" vspace="3"><TBODY><TR><TD> </TD></TR><TR><TD>[FONT=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][SIZE=-2]The death of Eight Belles has prompted action by the Jockey Club and the NTRA.
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Photo: Skip Dickstein
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In the wake of the fatal breakdown of the filly Eight Belles in the May 3 Kentucky Derby Presented by Yum! Brands (gr. I), The Jockey Club has commissioned a seven-member Thoroughbred Safety Committee, and the National Thoroughbred Racing Association board of directors has scheduled a special meeting May 9 to discuss a course of action.
Jockey Club chairman Ogden Mills “Dinny” Phipps said May 8 the new committee would be asked to review every facet of equine health, including breeding practices, medication, the rules of racing and track surfaces, and to recommend actions to be taken by the industry to improve the health and safety of Thoroughbreds.
Recommendations that have come from the two Welfare and Safety of the Racehorse summits will serve as starting points for the committee. Three of the seven members of the newly formed committee were participants in both summits.

Read NTRA CEO Alex Waldrop’s latest blog entry regarding safety in the racing industry.
When contacted May 8, Bob Curran, vice president of corporate communications for The Jockey Club, acknowledged the committee was formed in response to the breakdown and subsequent euthanization of Eight Belles in her gallop-out after the Derby, in which she finished second. The incident generated a barrage of attention from the national media and animal-rights groups.
“The committee is going to meet for the first time (May 14),” Curran said. “After the meeting, it will provide a summary of its goals and a timeline (for action).”
The seven members of the committee are Stuart Janney III, who will serve as chairman; John Barr; James G. “Jimmy” Bell; Dr. Larry Bramlage; Donald Dizney, Dell Hancock; and Dr. Hiram Polk Jr. Each is a member of The Jockey Club.
“All seven of these individuals have dedicated a major part of their lives to Thoroughbred breeding and racing, and have shown a consistent and unwavering concern for the welfare of Thoroughbreds,” Phipps said in a statement. “We will reach out to involve others in the industry, and we will do everything in our power to encourage changes that will benefit the breed in any way. We will do this in a timely manner.”
Keith Chamblin, senior vice president of communications for the NTRA, said the organization supports The Jockey Club initiative. He said the special NTRA board meeting is being held to discuss the fallout from the death of Eight Belles on horse racing’s biggest stage, but further details aren't yet available.
“We’ll be discussing everything (related to the situation),” Chamblin said of the meeting agenda.
The horseracing industry is now gearing up for the second leg of the Triple Crown, the May 17 Preakness Stakes (gr. I) at Pimlico Race Course. One animal-rights group--People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals--said it plans to hold demonstrations in conjunction with the Preakness and the June 7 Belmont Stakes (gr. I) in New York.

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