Vegas Still Bowing Down To William Hill....

[Heim]

In Vegas you still have to make one physical appearance in a book to open a mobile account. Pretty sure with
the exception of Iowa (pending), new sports betting states permit mobile activation by phone. The biggest
proponent of keeping the current law is William Hill who has a ton of remote locations while the smaller
independents are limited to one or two venues. Not sure why GCB bows down to a British group that bans winners
and tries to preclude bettors from line shopping.



https://www.cdcgamingreports.com/mo...ions-is-not-a-quick-fix/#.W-8aBlwlqTo.twitter

 

[MrTop]

1. they are on the take
2. investments with WH
3 getting something hookers, picks, drink tickets, parking etc.
4 all of the above.


how they heck do they have so many locations??? new jersey has a 3 bookmaker limit.

 

[John Kelly]

William Hill has a history of bullying players.

Shameful.

I love their betting menu but that's where my adoration ends.

 

[BenoitPaire2]

William Hill has a history of bullying players.

Shameful.

I love their betting menu but that's where my adoration ends.

Meanwhile, the WH in Rhode Island took a $20k first half bet on Georgetown ml on Wednesday. Hard to believe this is the same company....

 

[John Kelly]

I'm assuming the gambler is a proven loser.

William Hill loves to profile its players.

Losers are welcome, winners are not.

 

[Heim]

In a few years, Vegas will be Stations catering to the locals and WH everyone else.

They'll squeeze out everyone; recreational only.

Is the GCB that short-sighted not to see this?

They're more concerned with what is considered amateur for betting purposes!?

 

[skinny]

I'm assuming the gambler is a proven loser.

William Hill loves to profile its players.

Losers are welcome, winners are not.

Spot on.

They love to advertise the big bets they take, but believe me its only from suckers only.

Try to make a big bet where you're getting a point the best of it and see what happens.

You'll be told your business is no longer welcome.

 

[BenoitPaire2]

I'm assuming the gambler is a proven loser.

William Hill loves to profile its players.

Losers are welcome, winners are not.

Im Not sure if WH does the risk management for the sportsbook, so that also may play a part

It’s a 3-way partnership... William hill, igt and Rhode Island lottery. I know the lines are from William hill, and the technology is from
igt.... no idea where RI lottery comes in. One manager worked at a WH sportsbook in vegas for 6 years.. the other ones have little to no experience and they are from RI.

 

[John Kelly]

Nevada sports books are leaving a lot of money on the table.

They make money in spite of the management, not because of it.

Turn those licenses over to legitimate bookmakers and you'll see a huge difference in the bottom line.

Las Vegas operators are more concerned with hold percentages than profits.

Strange but true.

 

[MrTop]

Im Not sure if WH does the risk management for the sportsbook, so that also may play a part

It’s a 3-way partnership... William hill, igt and Rhode Island lottery. I know the lines are from William hill, and the technology is from
igt.... no idea where RI lottery comes in. One manager worked at a WH sportsbook in vegas for 6 years.. the other ones have little to no experience and they are from RI.

it seems like it is the same with all the books in NJ. The name is the same but the some of the lines are different from the vegas shops. I am figuring that they can manage the risk better.

 

[Heim]

Some of these alleged big bets a WH make my head spin. You can't even bet a nickle in Vegas unless you
have a WH players card. A few SB ago they had players sign their winning tickets and talk to someone on
the phone confirming identity before they cashed you out. It's probably true what I read the other day. In no
less than 5 years Vegas will be considered a Third World Country when it comes to sports bets.

 

[MrTop]

WH's money is their money and your money is half theirs

 

[John Kelly]

WH's money is their money and your money is half theirs

And yet William Hill is allowed to accept and reject wagers WHEN THE BALL IS IN THE AIR.

Tsk tsk.

So much for Nevada sports betting and its reputation for being so tightly-regulated.

 

[ejd_5277]

In Nevada, William Hill is directly booking your action.

In other states such as Mississippi, Rhode Island, and Delaware, they're acting only as a book manager.

Mississippi law states that the sports book must be owned by the casino in which it resides. WH is paid a flat fee by said casino(s) to run the operation.

In Delaware and Rhode Island, the state lottery books the action, again using WH only as an operator.

I confess to being unsure about the exact regulatory structure in WV, NJ, and PA, so I can't speak to those. (MrTop???)

At any rate, large wagers made in these other states are sent to William Hill's Nevada clearinghouse for approval. When the books are busy though, (fall weekends, etc.) I suspect the "traders" (or whatever they're called) that wind up handling these wagers booked in these other states are told to just approve them, freeing up resources to focus on wagers coming in from Nevada, which WH is directly on the hook for.

JK, you and I briefly touched on this in a phone conversation last fall.

 

[MrTop]

right now , If only playing legal I would rather have the Nevada betting shops over N.J. shops because of cg tech, westgate , wynn, South point , coast , stations & TI. Outside of limits of course & if all online

Two big books CG tech & Bet365 will enter NJ market before football . There will be others to join NJ , but they probably will not put out their own numbers. Ya never know though

 

[Foresthill]

Try to make a big bet where you're getting a point the best of it and see what happens.

Try to make a small in-play point spread bet at plus money at a kiosk, if you can find such a bet, without a WH card. Then be forced to wait for approval as play continues, only getting the bet if subsequent play goes against you. These small bets, win or lose, are immaterial to their results (rounded off on their balance sheets.) They are extremely cheap.

 

[MrTop]

by looking at don best Nevada #'s and looking at what NJ has on their online sites., sometimes the lines are different with all sports books that are both in NJ & Nevada. I have also noticed them changing to the same number at the same . NJ does put up over night lines from Nevada books, and don best shows nothing from the Nevada book. The Nevada bettors would have to chime in to tell me the overnights are not available in Nevada.

What could happen is NJ runs things overnight until the Nevada opens up in the morning then the cycle repeats

 

[Foresthill]

So much for Nevada sports betting and its reputation for being so tightly-regulated.

Missouri supposedly has the toughest gaming laws in the U.S. ( as of yet, no sports betting). The gaming agents are members of the highway patrol (plain clothes). You should see the application you have to fill out with the gaming commission to become a dealer.

 

[BenoitPaire2]

This is why I wonder about the affiliation with WH and Rhode Island.

When I was at Monmouth when the book opened, j was told to bet more than $100 I would have to sign up for a card.

At twin river, there is no betting card. There’s no rewards, no drink tickets, but more interestingly, no Id needed unless you cash out over $5000.

It’s very weirdly run.

Next time I see someone betting over the limits, I’ll try to record it so you guys can see just how different it is

 

[Polar]

Im Not sure if WH does the risk management for the sportsbook, so that also may play a part

It’s a 3-way partnership... William hill, igt and Rhode Island lottery. I know the lines are from William hill, and the technology is from
igt.... no idea where RI lottery comes in. One manager worked at a WH sportsbook in vegas for 6 years.. the other ones have little to no experience and they are from RI.

WH's risk management is limiting anyone with a clue.

Not exactly someone/company you would want to manage your bets.

But these newbie's obviously have no clue and have no idea who to ask that might steer them in the direction.

Disaster waiting to happen...

 

[John Kelly]

Go to the head of the class, Polar.

 

[BenoitPaire2]

WH's risk management is limiting anyone with a clue.

Not exactly someone/company you would want to manage your bets.

But these newbie's obviously have no clue and have no idea who to ask that might steer them in the direction.

Disaster waiting to happen...

They lost over 2 million in the super bowl, so it’s not going well

 

[TobyTyler]

I'm up about $3k at will hill nj, all app betting and most profits from nfl player props

I bet mostly rec amounts

Busted there month or so ago , never reupped

It's a quick ride to monmouth so that's a plus for me if I want to withdraw anything

But prob no dimelines there, so looking for one place to deposit for baseball. Right now just funded at 5dimes.

 

[ejd_5277]

I'm up about $3k at will hill nj, all app betting and most profits from nfl player props

I bet mostly rec amounts

Busted there month or so ago , never reupped

It's a quick ride to monmouth so that's a plus for me if I want to withdraw anything

But prob no dimelines there, so looking for one place to deposit for baseball. Right now just funded at 5dimes.

Last year, WH New Jersey had dime lines on MLB sides.

 

[WildBill]

I interviewed a guy who works at WH in Las Vegas and one of the two jobs he has is to do a weekly review of the "winners" from the week before. Literally they have someone who spends 20-30 hours a week data mining to find bettors whose projected hold is lower than they deem acceptable. I probed him a little more about this while trying to keep it on track that I was just trying to understand his analytical abilities and that shit is scary. He said there is an algorithm with many variables, but he threw out if your first bet is on a less prominent sport that gives it some points and some other stuff. He gave some other nuggets too about how Joe Asher basically takes a view that if you are borderline, he'd rather throw you out than see how things go another week or month. I asked isn't there a concern this is bad for business and he said oh no, the finance and analytics people judge everything on profit maximization and this is without a doubt the best way to maximize profit.

So yeah things are never going to change there. I didn't hire this guy even though I would have loved to pick his brain more. He said the work wasn't that challenging and wanted to do something else.

 

[TobyTyler]

Last year, WH New Jersey had dime lines on MLB sides.

Good to know, thought I heard they did not

 

[John Kelly]

I interviewed a guy who works at WH in Las Vegas and one of the two jobs he has is to do a weekly review of the "winners" from the week before. Literally they have someone who spends 20-30 hours a week data mining to find bettors whose projected hold is lower than they deem acceptable. I probed him a little more about this while trying to keep it on track that I was just trying to understand his analytical abilities and that shit is scary. He said there is an algorithm with many variables, but he threw out if your first bet is on a less prominent sport that gives it some points and some other stuff. He gave some other nuggets too about how Joe Asher basically takes a view that if you are borderline, he'd rather throw you out than see how things go another week or month. I asked isn't there a concern this is bad for business and he said oh no, the finance and analytics people judge everything on profit maximization and this is without a doubt the best way to maximize profit.

So yeah things are never going to change there. I didn't hire this guy even though I would have loved to pick his brain more. He said the work wasn't that challenging and wanted to do something else.

Thanks for sharing, WildBill.

 

[BenoitPaire2]

I interviewed a guy who works at WH in Las Vegas and one of the two jobs he has is to do a weekly review of the "winners" from the week before. Literally they have someone who spends 20-30 hours a week data mining to find bettors whose projected hold is lower than they deem acceptable. I probed him a little more about this while trying to keep it on track that I was just trying to understand his analytical abilities and that shit is scary. He said there is an algorithm with many variables, but he threw out if your first bet is on a less prominent sport that gives it some points and some other stuff. He gave some other nuggets too about how Joe Asher basically takes a view that if you are borderline, he'd rather throw you out than see how things go another week or month. I asked isn't there a concern this is bad for business and he said oh no, the finance and analytics people judge everything on profit maximization and this is without a doubt the best way to maximize profit.

So yeah things are never going to change there. I didn't hire this guy even though I would have loved to pick his brain more. He said the work wasn't that challenging and wanted to do something else.

The biggest obstacle with Risk management in Rhode Island is that there are no cards or rewards system to track the winners. No card system is bad for business for them.

 

[High Times]

I interviewed a guy who works at WH in Las Vegas and one of the two jobs he has is to do a weekly review of the "winners" from the week before. Literally they have someone who spends 20-30 hours a week data mining to find bettors whose projected hold is lower than they deem acceptable. I probed him a little more about this while trying to keep it on track that I was just trying to understand his analytical abilities and that shit is scary. He said there is an algorithm with many variables, but he threw out if your first bet is on a less prominent sport that gives it some points and some other stuff. He gave some other nuggets too about how Joe Asher basically takes a view that if you are borderline, he'd rather throw you out than see how things go another week or month. I asked isn't there a concern this is bad for business and he said oh no, the finance and analytics people judge everything on profit maximization and this is without a doubt the best way to maximize profit.

So yeah things are never going to change there. I didn't hire this guy even though I would have loved to pick his brain more. He said the work wasn't that challenging and wanted to do something else.

It is absolutely NOT the best way to maximize profits..... That is unless you don't know what you're doing... Then it probably is the way to go. Should be considered illegal. That's what limits are for....

If you don't know what you're doing you should not be allowed to book only losers. FUCKING PERIOD

 

[High Times]

It is simply impossible for the bookmakers to take bets and not take bets that are sharp and force them to move the lines.

That's how bookmaking works!

To allow a legal sports book the right to only accept wagers from the losers is just unacceptable, but for some reason most sport bettors AND bookmakers and the gaming agencies allow it.

They should have their license taken away!

 

[John Kelly]

HT speaks from experience.

 

[WildBill]

It is absolutely NOT the best way to maximize profits..... That is unless you don't know what you're doing... Then it probably is the way to go. Should be considered illegal. That's what limits are for....

If you don't know what you're doing you should not be allowed to book only losers. FUCKING PERIOD

Mr. Asher doesn't give a shit I guess. I worked with him on a few things years ago, would not have figured him to believe this business model is correct. Either he switched to this religion talking to too many former bankers at Cantor or William Hill beat him down into singing the chorus he does today.