Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

[Flamingo kid]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

The problem with Walker's attitude and policies is that his places ultimately would become places in general to avoid for sports bettor which is a WRONG and unnecessary message to send to players. Alienating customers doesn't work.It backfires. It actually skews the greedy fuzzy math they use to justify their conduct. Places and especially the super nice places that Walker ran absolutely should NOT send that signal.Reading between the lines Walker embraces that arrogant attitude.Please come to my place but promise to lose.It's like a bad faith insurance company that refuses to pay a legit claim- he wants things both ways.

I'll give credit-at least Walker consistently admits his crappy self serving attitude.He even spells it out in black and white.:whip:
Looking back it is not surprising that the head up their ass upper management idiots at all times were on board with Walker and his poor narrow minded thinking attitude.
Walker probably thinks I don't get his message.That unto itself is a bad thing.
The best mangers understand that you can be a players manger without giving away the farm.

I like this post. I think bad race book managers (whoever they happen to be) might convince themselves that its them against the sharps and they inject that into their business when they should just understand that you don't want to take things personally, its just business and as a good businessman, you want to embrace your customers and thank them for their business.

If you, as a racebook manager, do your job properly, you'll win in the long run. You have the edge, they're paying 11 to win 10, so you don't really need to bring this arrogant "im paid to wear a suit and make gambling decisions so i must be better than you" attitude to the table.

In the long run, the book will win....there's really no reason not to treat everyone with respect. Acting like an elitist asshole isnt going to get you more money and it isnt going to make the quality of your life better.

You can be a nice guy and still make a profit.

 

[LQQKer]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

There is so much wrong with the management of walk-ins today, that I don't have the time nor inclination to go into it.

You fucks had the Golden Goose, and have basically killed it off. The future is electronic, which the head-up-their-arse Nevadans don't get. You could have branded early and cornered the world market, but tried to "protect" your soon to be alienated walk-ins.

Die in peace M*therF*ckers, the future doesn't need you.

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Insightful posts.

I especially like what Bomzee and LQKKER wrote.

 

[FISHHEAD]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Keith Glantz understood the relationship between customer and book....so did Nick B. from the Horseshoe...those kinds of guys are few and far between...

Ok, will stop LURKING.........


Opinion on this tilted for obvious reasons, but there was never anyone better in this respect in my opinion than the late great SONNY REIZNER.

 

[Viejo Dinosaur]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Ok, will stop LURKING.........


Opinion on this tilted for obvious reasons, but there was never anyone better in this respect in my opinion than the late great SONNY REIZNER.

He invented the circled games....:lol

 

[wantitall4moi]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Everyone is looking at this from a sports bettors perspective thats why the views are skewed.

Sports books are a bane for most places. Well all places actually. If there isnt a computer chip in it or it cant be plugged in casinos dont want it. They tolerate horse players because they get a small cut of the big pie, and they dont stand to lose any money on it.

The mentality of most people here is that sportsbooks should be able to cater to everyone. BUt we all know that isnt true. The only way for that to be close to possible was if al books were tied together and were willing to lay off with each other and help balance action between them so that all could offer lines somewhat diferent but have enough profit margin on them to be able to trade them amongst themselves. Akin to how bankers shop interest rates around to each other or buy debt.

Obviously this means a more controled system where lines would be more homogenized than they are now. So what would happen is probably an increase in the ability to get more money down, but the inability to see big line moves or swings in prices as books woudnt have to move THEIR line to balance their action or move on air to match another books move, they would just trade off amongst themselves and balance it that wy and no one would have to move a line, unless the amount was so overwhelming one way they couldnt even balance it off with all the casinos working together.

I am surprised that hasnt happened yet, but maybe there are laws against it or anti trust issues.

Limits are limits, but to me if the limits are small enough to effect anyone but the most casual of casuals theyre too low.

But it also touches on what I talked about inmy other post, different sports and how they are handled. NFL and NBA are two different animals, so obviously NFL and tennis or golf or Nascar are light years apart in terms of betting popularity.

So does a book have an obligation to offer aline on every sport going? Most here woud say yes. BUt since the sportsbook is just part of a much bigger conglomeratoin the truth is quite the opposite.

If anything this all basically proves that sports arent 'beatable' for either side. Books dont know anymore about sports than the bettors do. The volatility and unpredictability of sport in general just makes it look that way. Books 'win' because they do enough volume with the least amount of risk. Akin to what scalpers and arbitragers do. When a player becomes the book he can actually be more efficient because he gets to pick and choose and cherry pick what games he puts action on. Books dont have that luxury if they book a sport thy have to book all the games in that sport regardless of the action.

 

[FISHHEAD]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

He invented the circled games....:lol

That he did...................and a hoopla of other sportsbooking techniques.


Many of his theories are practiced to this day in a few VEGAS sportsbooks.


Someday Veijo, will show you how the SONNY REIZNER BOOKMAKING CHART was done and updated.............

 

[FISHHEAD]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

He invented the circled games....:lol

That he did..........................


Many of Sonny's bookmaking practices are still used around the city today(many castoffs from his philosphy's)...........WYNN, JERRYS NUGGET, TREASURE ISLAND to name just three.


Veijo, someday in the future will show you how the SONNY bookmaking chart was made AND updated........................


Actually, to this day Sonny has an effect on my "OCD" obsession with keeping gaming records.

 

[mirageburbank]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

A quick reply --

11 to win 10 and you will win in the long run.

That is true if someone bet every game. We have to book all of the games, but the sharps don't have to bet them all. Their ability to be selective and search for "value" is my contention of why Cantor's bookmaking if flawed.

I'm not sure which sports bettors removed us from the list as we got hit on every move for the limit by someone. If its because of the 20 cent line then certainly I understand. However, I don't believe that was the case during football or basketball season.

I guess I don't understand what a "players manager" is and as such, should we share the farm with them since we do not have to give the farm away.

"The best managers understood that" -- NO. They did not.

And JK I left for one reason -- family

It was without a doubt the toughest decision of my life. My contract was expiring and it was either sign a new deal, or move my daughter to Washington state.

Her mother had passed away when she was 10 and she was getting ready to start high school. Because I worked 60 sometimes 70 hours a week, every Christmas and Thanksgiving of her life, I had missed important milestones.

It finally came down to at the end of my life would I lament not going to 3 on a game, or the years I would spend with her.

My father was also in poor health (given last rites twice). I have four brothers, my parents and my friends here. I have no family in Las Vegas.

As a result, I have watched my daughter participate on the cheer and dance teams each year. She has always been a great dancer. And I have gotten to spend time with my parents nearly each and every day.

That was the issue. Nothing else. I loved my time at the Stardust and the MGM MIRAGE and always felt in the back of my mind that I would be back when my daughter is done with high school.

Well, that time is now. She wants to go to UNLV, and with sports betting having a chance with New Jersey challenging the Bradley Bill, it may be a boon for several states soon.

And I would like to be part of it.

Have a great New Year's everyone.

I enjoyed the debate. I did mind the name calling. I have heard worse and at least half of the names were probably true.

 

[High Times]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Ok, will stop LURKING.........


Opinion on this tilted for obvious reasons, but there was never anyone better in this respect in my opinion than the late great SONNY REIZNER.

He threw me out because I told him he should just paint those circles on the board.

The most overrated sports book manager in the history of this business.

He was actually the first book manager to start this "we are scared of the wise guy" crap.

Sorry fish

:btj:

 

[High Times]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Keith Glantz understood the relationship between customer and book....so did Nick B. from the Horseshoe...those kinds of guys are few and far between...

Keith Glantz is one of the few people on this planet that I would leave in charge of a Major sports book. The dude is as sharp as they come.

Also a great guy


(Blackie too)

Those 2 guys were fearless and would never accept that "we hate sharp bettors" crap

 

[FISHHEAD]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

He threw me out because I told him he should just paint those circles on the board.

The most overrated sports book manager in the history of this business.

He was actually the first book manager to start this "we are scared of the wise guy" crap.

Sorry fish

:btj:

:lol:lol

 

[mirageburbank]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Not from a bettors perspective perhaps, but I don't think there were too many nicer guys than Keith Glantz or Sonny Reizner in the industry.

 

[High Times]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

:lol:lol

He was good at what he did though op:

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Robert Walker will be our guest tonight on The EOG Sports Hour.

You can hear the program live on KLAV-AM 1230 (www.klav1230am.com) tonight at 10:00 Pacific time or hear an archived version of the show at www.eogradio.com.

 

[Flamingo kid]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Robert Walker will be our guest tonight on The EOG Sports Hour.

You can hear the program live on KLAV-AM 1230 (www.klav1230am.com) tonight at 10:00 Pacific time or hear an archived version of the show at www.eogradio.com.

I'd like to ask if he's had any 'memorable' stories he can share involving big bets, big bettors or celebrities he's dealt with over the years. I know a couple of famous degenerates Antoine Walker, Charles Barkley, etc have visited Vegas from time to time and been known to drop a lot of cash, i'd love to hear 'inside' stories if he has any that he can talk about.

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

I'd like to ask if he's had any 'memorable' stories he can share involving big bets, big bettors or celebrities he's dealt with over the years. I know a couple of famous degenerates Antoine Walker, Charles Barkley, etc have visited Vegas from time to time and been known to drop a lot of cash, i'd love to hear 'inside' stories if he has any that he can talk about.

I'll ask the question, FK.

 

[O'Royken]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Many former employees suffer from a terrible condition called LSE....Low Self-Esteem. Signs of this condition are: A public display of envy, an uncontrollable desire to tear down others' accomplishments by the use of their negative tongue, a constant pursuit of physical attention because they lack the intellectual ability to attract high-minded individuals of substance. In many cases, they have carried the Virus/POISON for such an extended period of time, they are no longer aware they are a carrier. WARNING....this condition is HIGHLY contagious so STAY CLEAR of these individuals! They can be hazardous to your faith in the human race.

 

[mirageburbank]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

A couple of things about Cantor that I was remiss in my blog and on the radio last night.

I think Cantor has done a tremendous job in its mobile and in game wagering. While I don't believe that in game wagering is going to be huge in Nevada alone, it will be monsterous if the Bradley Bill is overturned.

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Mobile wagering is overrated in the state of Nevada because of the current convenience of placing a wager.

Most sports bettors in Las Vegas are five minutes away from placing a wager at the nearest sports book.

 

[Scooter]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Mobile wagering is overrated in the state of Nevada because of the current convenience of placing a wager.

Most sports bettors in Las Vegas are five minutes away from placing a wager at the nearest sports book.

5 minutes away means 30 minutes from the time one leaves to return -

Exit home to car.
Wander thru casino parking lot.
Traipse thru 100 yards of parking lot and casino to sportsbook, inhaling 2nd hand smoke indoors.
Wait in line behind a guy betting a $2 10 team parlay card who hasn't decided who he's betting on yet - and doesn't even know who's playing.
Traipse back 100 yards thru casino and lot to car.
Drive home.

During the trip, avoid car accidents, car being burglarized in lot, and being robbed.

Or - spend 30 seconds sitting on the couch and placing bet.

Mobile betting has a great future.


"Most sports bettors in Las Vegas are five minutes away from placing a wager at the nearest sports book."

This is nonsense also.
Many sportsbettors live in areas not near sportsbooks.
I lived in Henderson, and the nearest book, Green Valley Ranch, was about a 20 minute drive.

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Good points, Scooter.

I'll rethink my position.

I'd love to see the number of participants and handle figures from existing phone accounts in Nevada.

 

[Squarepants]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Yeah, John, I'm coming 'round to Scooter's viewpoint. ("Scooter," reminds me of that movie "Confidence," with Ed Burns, Dustin Hoffman and Rachel Weisz -- great movie and great song at the end.) Even living behind LVH in LVCC and working near the Fremont Street outs, physically running around and placing bets is like a third job, after the day job and handicapping. Between the time involved and not getting a number that I want because of time and logistics, I'm giving serious consideration to signing up for as many mobile accounts as currently are and later become available.

 

[FISHHEAD]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Between the time involved and not getting a number that I want because of time and logistics, I'm giving serious consideration to signing up for as many mobile accounts as currently are and later become available.

Highly recommend

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Mobile wagering could be the future of sports betting.

But here in Las Vegas, the number of players content with their betting situations far outnumber the players displeased with their access to play.

Nationwide, now that's a different story.

 

[Squarepants]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

And then there's the whole issue of resisting the urge to clock the next person in the casino who pretends that they don't see me while trying to walk straight through me as I'm bee-lining for the book. I walk fast but courteously when I'm being my own runner, and I don't really take a liking to those who don't at least walk courteously. So, yeah, going mobile might keep me out of CCDC, lol.

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

And then there's the whole issue of resisting the urge to clock the next person in the casino who pretends that they don't see me while trying to walk straight through me as I'm bee-lining for the book. I walk fast but courteously when I'm being my own runner, and I don't really take a liking to those who don't at least walk courteously. So, yeah, going mobile might keep me out of CCDC, lol.

Wonder if Floyd Mayweather will have access to his Cantor tablet when he spends 90 days in the pokey?

 

[Squarepants]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Yeah, I see a lot of folks who basically hang at one book. But, even when I was a tourist, I'd get off the plane, check the lines on a PC at Kinko's, and then run around trying to snag the best number that still was available. These days, I'm usually just in and out to place a bet and/or hopefully cash and then I watch the games at home where I can concentrate as necessary and start prepping for upcoming games. For that, yeah, I need to go as mobile as possible both for more effective line-shopping and for overall time management.

 

[Squarepants]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

LOL, as to Mayweather and his tablet -- reminds me of that E-Trade commercial where the kid pulls out the tablet from under the blanket and starts singing some chain gang blues.

 

[John Kelly]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

LOL, as to Mayweather and his tablet -- reminds me of that E-Trade commercial where the kid pulls out the tablet from under the blanket and starts singing some chain gang blues.

Love the commercial despite seeing it hundreds of times.

 

[Scooter]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

John, thanks for the polite response.

Now that I've said the above - currently, the technology is still lousy - not the possible technology, but the way the apps and even worse pager accounts are currently designed.
A lot of times it feels like it would be easier and less frustrating to go to the book.

Hopefully they'll be making a lot of improvements - they range from pathetic to disappointing currently.

And currently, the majority of Vegas books don't take phone bets.

 

[Scooter]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

And then there's the whole issue of resisting the urge to clock the next person in the casino who pretends that they don't see me while trying to walk straight through me as I'm bee-lining for the book. I walk fast but courteously when I'm being my own runner, and I don't really take a liking to those who don't at least walk courteously. So, yeah, going mobile might keep me out of CCDC, lol.

I always feel like I'm in the Jim Carrey film "The Truman Show" when I'm in a casino, and that people are being given instructions like "Scooter is racing up the aisle now heading for the sportsbook, trying to grab a number before it's gone. Step in front of him NOW, walk at an elephant pace, then stop dead and act fascinated watching someone playing Wheel of Fortune rack up 22 five cent credits."

 

[Squarepants]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

LOL . . . that's exactly the same experience I'm having, Scooter . . . it all makes so much more sense now when it's attributed to an overall intentional plan orchestrated by an unseen overseer.

: ^ )

 

[LQQKer]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

I always feel like I'm in the Jim Carrey film "The Truman Show" when I'm in a casino, and that people are being given instructions like "Scooter is racing up the aisle now heading for the sportsbook, trying to grab a number before it's gone. Step in front of him NOW, walk at an elephant pace, then stop dead and act fascinated watching someone playing Wheel of Fortune rack up 22 five cent credits."

GOD IS WATCHING YOU.:eye:

 

[Scooter]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

GOD IS WATCHING YOU.:eye:

Wrong. God is too busy fixing Denver Broncos games for his man Tebow.

 

[LQQKer]

Re: Why Cantor Gaming will either fail or revamp its bookmaking philosophy

Wrong. God is too busy fixing Denver Broncos games for his man Tebow.

This guy has a deal with the other guy...View attachment 7673