Doc Mercer
EOG Master
CNN just broke it
Thank God Palin is able to keep an eye on North Korea from her backyard
Thank God Palin is able to keep an eye on North Korea from her backyard
North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
- Thread starter Doc Mercer
- Start date
Doc Mercer
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
SEOUL (Reuters) - North Korea launched a long-range rocket on Sunday that passed over Japan, the government in Tokyo said, defying calls from world leaders to scrap a plan that has caused international alarm.
The U.S. State Department confirmed North Korea had launched the rocket but had no further details. South Korea's presidential Blue House would make a statement at 11:00 p.m. EDT, KBS TV said.
Japan said the rocket's second booster stage had splashed down in the Pacific Ocean, indicating the launch had been successful.
"The projectile launched from North Korea today appears to have passed over toward the Pacific," the Japan prime minister's office said in a statement.
http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE530582200...
SEOUL (Reuters) - North Korea launched a long-range rocket on Sunday that passed over Japan, the government in Tokyo said, defying calls from world leaders to scrap a plan that has caused international alarm.
The U.S. State Department confirmed North Korea had launched the rocket but had no further details. South Korea's presidential Blue House would make a statement at 11:00 p.m. EDT, KBS TV said.
Japan said the rocket's second booster stage had splashed down in the Pacific Ocean, indicating the launch had been successful.
"The projectile launched from North Korea today appears to have passed over toward the Pacific," the Japan prime minister's office said in a statement.
http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE530582200...
Doc Mercer
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
rumor has it Munchkin Man is busy breaking open those boxes of duct tape
rumor has it Munchkin Man is busy breaking open those boxes of duct tape
Doc Mercer
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
I wonder if China was pushing NK to test Obama?
New Concerns Over Chinese 'Carrier-Killer'
April 01, 2009
U.S. Naval Institute
With tensions already rising due to the Chinese navy becoming more aggressive in asserting its territorial claims in the South China Sea, the U.S. Navy seems to have yet another reason to be deeply concerned.
After years of conjecture, details have begun to emerge of a "kill weapon" developed by the Chinese to target and destroy U.S. aircraft carriers.
First posted on a Chinese blog viewed as credible by military analysts and then translated by the naval affairs blog Information Dissemination, a recent report provides a description of an anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) that can strike carriers and other U.S. vessels at a range of 2000km.
The range of the modified Dong Feng 21 missile is significant in that it covers the areas that are likely hot zones for future confrontations between U.S. and Chinese surface forces.
The size of the missile enables it to carry a warhead big enough to inflict significant damage on a large vessel, providing the Chinese the capability of destroying a U.S. supercarrier in one strike.
Because the missile employs a complex guidance system, low radar signature and a maneuverability that makes its flight path unpredictable, the odds that it can evade tracking systems to reach its target are increased. It is estimated that the missile can travel at mach 10 and reach its maximum range of 2000km in less than 12 minutes.
http://www.military.com/news/article/April-2009/new-con...
I wonder if China was pushing NK to test Obama?
New Concerns Over Chinese 'Carrier-Killer'
April 01, 2009
U.S. Naval Institute
With tensions already rising due to the Chinese navy becoming more aggressive in asserting its territorial claims in the South China Sea, the U.S. Navy seems to have yet another reason to be deeply concerned.
After years of conjecture, details have begun to emerge of a "kill weapon" developed by the Chinese to target and destroy U.S. aircraft carriers.
First posted on a Chinese blog viewed as credible by military analysts and then translated by the naval affairs blog Information Dissemination, a recent report provides a description of an anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) that can strike carriers and other U.S. vessels at a range of 2000km.
The range of the modified Dong Feng 21 missile is significant in that it covers the areas that are likely hot zones for future confrontations between U.S. and Chinese surface forces.
The size of the missile enables it to carry a warhead big enough to inflict significant damage on a large vessel, providing the Chinese the capability of destroying a U.S. supercarrier in one strike.
Because the missile employs a complex guidance system, low radar signature and a maneuverability that makes its flight path unpredictable, the odds that it can evade tracking systems to reach its target are increased. It is estimated that the missile can travel at mach 10 and reach its maximum range of 2000km in less than 12 minutes.
http://www.military.com/news/article/April-2009/new-con...
4625
2
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
The U.S. Naval Institute is a reputable source, but here's another viewpoint regarding the rumored refitted Chinese missile:
The Annual Magic Missile Announcement
<!-- Article Start --> April 3, 2009: In what has become an annual event over the last few years, there are another batch of rumors out of China that the DF-21 ballistic <nobr style="font-weight: normal; font-size: 100%;" id="itxt_nobr_0_0">missile
</nobr> has been equipped with a high-explosive warhead and a guidance system that can find and hit a aircraft carrier at sea. The DF-21 has a range of 1800 kilometers and normally hauls a 300 kiloton nuclear warhead. It's a two stage, 15 ton, solid fuel rocket that could carry a half ton penetrating, high-explosive warhead, along with the special guidance system (a radar and image recognition system). As the story goes, the Chinese have reverse engineered, reinvented or stolen the 1970s seeker technology that went into the U.S. Pershing ballistic missile. This 7.5 ton U.S. Army missile also had an 1,800 kilometer range, and could put its nuclear warhead within 30 meters of its aim point. This was possible because the guidance system had its own radar. This kind of accuracy made the Russians very uncomfortable, as it made their command bunkers vulnerable. The Russians eventually agreed to a lot of nuclear and missile disarmament deals in order to get the Pershings decommissioned in the 1980s.
The Chinese have long been rumored to have a system like this, but there have been no tests. If the Chinese do succeed in creating a "carrier killer" version of the DF-21, the U.S. Navy can modify its Aegis anti-missile system to protect carriers against such attacks. There are also electronic warfare options, to blind the DF-21 radar. Another problem the Chinese will have is getting a general idea of where the target carrier is before they launch the DF-21. This is not impossible, but can be difficult. But first, the Chinese have to conduct some of tests of this wondrous new weapon. So far, there have been no tests.
http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htintel/articles/20090403.aspx
_________________________________________
This is, of course, a big story, if accurate; our carrier battle-groups are a very large part of how America projects power on the world stage. I'm going to see what else is out there regarding this topic when I get time.
The U.S. Naval Institute is a reputable source, but here's another viewpoint regarding the rumored refitted Chinese missile:
The Annual Magic Missile Announcement
<!-- Article Start --> April 3, 2009: In what has become an annual event over the last few years, there are another batch of rumors out of China that the DF-21 ballistic <nobr style="font-weight: normal; font-size: 100%;" id="itxt_nobr_0_0">missile
</nobr> has been equipped with a high-explosive warhead and a guidance system that can find and hit a aircraft carrier at sea. The DF-21 has a range of 1800 kilometers and normally hauls a 300 kiloton nuclear warhead. It's a two stage, 15 ton, solid fuel rocket that could carry a half ton penetrating, high-explosive warhead, along with the special guidance system (a radar and image recognition system). As the story goes, the Chinese have reverse engineered, reinvented or stolen the 1970s seeker technology that went into the U.S. Pershing ballistic missile. This 7.5 ton U.S. Army missile also had an 1,800 kilometer range, and could put its nuclear warhead within 30 meters of its aim point. This was possible because the guidance system had its own radar. This kind of accuracy made the Russians very uncomfortable, as it made their command bunkers vulnerable. The Russians eventually agreed to a lot of nuclear and missile disarmament deals in order to get the Pershings decommissioned in the 1980s. The Chinese have long been rumored to have a system like this, but there have been no tests. If the Chinese do succeed in creating a "carrier killer" version of the DF-21, the U.S. Navy can modify its Aegis anti-missile system to protect carriers against such attacks. There are also electronic warfare options, to blind the DF-21 radar. Another problem the Chinese will have is getting a general idea of where the target carrier is before they launch the DF-21. This is not impossible, but can be difficult. But first, the Chinese have to conduct some of tests of this wondrous new weapon. So far, there have been no tests.
http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htintel/articles/20090403.aspx
_________________________________________
This is, of course, a big story, if accurate; our carrier battle-groups are a very large part of how America projects power on the world stage. I'm going to see what else is out there regarding this topic when I get time.
Doc Mercer
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
4625:
don't they have those missles called "Sunburst" (????? ---- sorry ... spacing
out on the name)
I read something on Global Security that they sold a bunch to Iran and can't be picked up on radar and our ships in the Gulf would have their "hands full"
4625:
don't they have those missles called "Sunburst" (????? ---- sorry ... spacing
out on the name)
I read something on Global Security that they sold a bunch to Iran and can't be picked up on radar and our ships in the Gulf would have their "hands full"
4625
2
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
I've only heard of the "Silkworm" Chinese anti-ship missile, so I did a little looking around. Wiki has the goods, and there are many "S" names for the Chinese hardware:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silkworm_missile
It's important to note that none of these missiles are ballistic. Hence, the uproar over the allegedly modified Dong Feng-21, which is ballistic.
I've located another somewhat dated story (again short on hard facts) which discusses the DF-21:
China Developing Anti-Ship Ballistic Missiles
BY wendell minnick
Published: 14 January 2008
Print |
Email
<!-- CLEAR BOX -->
TAIPEI, Taiwan - China is developing anti-ship ballistic missiles (ASBMs) that could sink U.S. aircraft carriers responding to a Taiwan Strait crisis, a development that has some defense analysts and former U.S. and Taiwan government officials envisioning scenarios like this:
In March 2012, Washington responds to Chinese threats to invade Taiwan by sending two U.S. aircraft carrier groups toward the Taiwan Strait. Rhetoric out of Beijing and Washington escalates with threats and counterthreats, then open battle.
Related Topics
On the second day, Taiwan and U.S. fighter aircraft engage Chinese aircraft over the strait in what one Taiwanese pilot describes as a hornet's nest from hell. On the third day, two dozen ASBMs sink the aircraft carriers and several Aegis-equipped destroyers and amphibious warfare ships, killing more than 18,000 U.S. sailors and Marines. In just under an hour, the Chinese inflict four times the losses of the Iraq war.
"Based on Chinese doctrinal and technical publications, among the more interesting programs has been research and development on advanced conventional ballistic missiles with maneuvering re-entry vehicles and terminal guidance," said Mark Stokes, a former country director for China on the U.S. defense secretary's staff and a former military attach? in Beijing.
"Successful deployment of conventional medium-range ballistic missiles, such as the DF-21C, as well as extended-range short-range ballistic missiles (SBRM), with terminal guidance packages, could hold at risk U.S. carrier battle groups intervening in a crisis."
The DF-21C - the road-mobile Dong Feng 21C (East Wind) medium-range ballistic missile with a range of 2,500 kilometers - is the most serious threat to U.S. aircraft carrier groups approaching the Taiwan Strait, said Lin Chong-Pin, former Taiwan deputy minister of defense.
"The DF-21 can be mounted with five kinds of warheads, all designed with U.S. aircraft carrier groups in mind," Lin said. "Parenthetically, the humiliation felt by the People's Liberation Army [PLA] after the 1996 Taiwan Strait crisis provided the greatest impetus for Beijing to acquire these capabilities that have been deployed since 2004."
In March 1996, the United States sent two aircraft carrier groups to the Taiwan Strait area in response to Beijing's threats. During the crisis, China test-fired several DF-15 (M-9) SRBMs in the waters around Taiwan and vowed to deny access to the area to U.S. warships in a future conflict.
"The PLA and China's defense industry has been focused on being able to deter or disrupt U.S. intervention in a Taiwan Strait crisis for more than a decade," Stokes said. "Authoritative Chinese writings indicate that a fundamental requirement would be to deny U.S. carrier battle groups and their logistics support access to the area of operations. To do so, the PLA would need an integrated system of sensors, survivable communication systems, and advanced weaponry to achieve the desired effects."
Artillery Corps
The People's Liberation Army Second Artillery, the heart and soul of China's missile command, has roughly 1,300 DF-11 and DF-15 short-range ballistic missiles aimed at Taiwan.
China also has the Russian-built SS-N-22 Sunburn anti-ship missiles outfitted on four new Russian refitted Sovremenny-class destroyers in the Chinese Navy. The Sunburn is designed to overcome cruise missile defenses by rising above the target and slamming down through the deck of an aircraft carrier.
"The capabilities described above constitute 'deterrence by denial' and should be viewed in a larger context of China's deterrence of U.S. aircraft carrier groups in order to seize the island with the least bloodshed and physical damage," Lin said.
The United States is not without options. The U.S. Navy is armed with Standard SM-3 missiles and attempts will be made to deny Chinese access to GPS during a conflict. China's positioning satellites, the geosynchronous Beidou, do not cover the western Pacific.
However, Lin said China's possession of an ASBM will throw a wrench into Washington's decision-making apparatus on what to do about the eruption of a Taiwan Strait crisis.
"To intervene or not to intervene, that is the question. While the U.S. National Security Council is deliberating with hesitancy, the PLA can seize Taiwan with its conventional forces in a quick war of paralysis rather than annihilation," Lin said.
"The still larger context which I have mentioned is that the top priority of Beijing on Taiwan is to 'absorb without war.' The military option is the lowest, but under aggressive and speedy preparation. However, even the military option has never been to 'strike the U.S. and to destroy Taiwan,' but rather 'to deter the U.S. and to seize Taiwan' intact as much as possible."
Could the U.S. Intervene?
Stokes said a "question many friends in Taiwan have asked is whether or not the United States would intervene, should the PRC use force against Taiwan. As time goes on, it may become more of a question of could the U.S. intervene with sufficient alacrity before being handed a fait accompli."
Paul Giarra, a retired U.S. naval officer, strategic planner and defense analyst, believes it is debatable whether the U.S. Navy's visions for fleet ballistic missile defense plans will be sufficient to meet this threat.
"This points to a strategic-operational campaign of slow reduction of Chinese operational capabilities from great distance, over a considerable period of time, rather than a rapidly concluded attack from forward positions with the advantage of exterior lines of communication and freedom of the seas," he said.
"Since the Air Force sneezes when the Navy catches cold in the Asia-Pacific aerospace theater of operations, this Chinese capability thereby will make it difficult for the U.S. military to operate close enough to employ not only its naval surface fleet, but its land-based air power as well, Giarra said. Chinese multiple-warhead [anti-ballistic missiles] will necessitate significant technical and operational responses on the part of the American military."
"While history does not repeat, it does rhyme. A Chinese ASBM scenario would appear to bring us back to early 1942, and the start of the long advance on Tokyo."
http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?i=3307277
I've only heard of the "Silkworm" Chinese anti-ship missile, so I did a little looking around. Wiki has the goods, and there are many "S" names for the Chinese hardware:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silkworm_missile
It's important to note that none of these missiles are ballistic. Hence, the uproar over the allegedly modified Dong Feng-21, which is ballistic.
I've located another somewhat dated story (again short on hard facts) which discusses the DF-21:
China Developing Anti-Ship Ballistic Missiles
BY wendell minnick
Published: 14 January 2008
Print |
Email<!-- CLEAR BOX -->
TAIPEI, Taiwan - China is developing anti-ship ballistic missiles (ASBMs) that could sink U.S. aircraft carriers responding to a Taiwan Strait crisis, a development that has some defense analysts and former U.S. and Taiwan government officials envisioning scenarios like this:
In March 2012, Washington responds to Chinese threats to invade Taiwan by sending two U.S. aircraft carrier groups toward the Taiwan Strait. Rhetoric out of Beijing and Washington escalates with threats and counterthreats, then open battle.
Related Topics
On the second day, Taiwan and U.S. fighter aircraft engage Chinese aircraft over the strait in what one Taiwanese pilot describes as a hornet's nest from hell. On the third day, two dozen ASBMs sink the aircraft carriers and several Aegis-equipped destroyers and amphibious warfare ships, killing more than 18,000 U.S. sailors and Marines. In just under an hour, the Chinese inflict four times the losses of the Iraq war.
"Based on Chinese doctrinal and technical publications, among the more interesting programs has been research and development on advanced conventional ballistic missiles with maneuvering re-entry vehicles and terminal guidance," said Mark Stokes, a former country director for China on the U.S. defense secretary's staff and a former military attach? in Beijing.
"Successful deployment of conventional medium-range ballistic missiles, such as the DF-21C, as well as extended-range short-range ballistic missiles (SBRM), with terminal guidance packages, could hold at risk U.S. carrier battle groups intervening in a crisis."
The DF-21C - the road-mobile Dong Feng 21C (East Wind) medium-range ballistic missile with a range of 2,500 kilometers - is the most serious threat to U.S. aircraft carrier groups approaching the Taiwan Strait, said Lin Chong-Pin, former Taiwan deputy minister of defense.
"The DF-21 can be mounted with five kinds of warheads, all designed with U.S. aircraft carrier groups in mind," Lin said. "Parenthetically, the humiliation felt by the People's Liberation Army [PLA] after the 1996 Taiwan Strait crisis provided the greatest impetus for Beijing to acquire these capabilities that have been deployed since 2004."
In March 1996, the United States sent two aircraft carrier groups to the Taiwan Strait area in response to Beijing's threats. During the crisis, China test-fired several DF-15 (M-9) SRBMs in the waters around Taiwan and vowed to deny access to the area to U.S. warships in a future conflict.
"The PLA and China's defense industry has been focused on being able to deter or disrupt U.S. intervention in a Taiwan Strait crisis for more than a decade," Stokes said. "Authoritative Chinese writings indicate that a fundamental requirement would be to deny U.S. carrier battle groups and their logistics support access to the area of operations. To do so, the PLA would need an integrated system of sensors, survivable communication systems, and advanced weaponry to achieve the desired effects."
Artillery Corps
The People's Liberation Army Second Artillery, the heart and soul of China's missile command, has roughly 1,300 DF-11 and DF-15 short-range ballistic missiles aimed at Taiwan.
China also has the Russian-built SS-N-22 Sunburn anti-ship missiles outfitted on four new Russian refitted Sovremenny-class destroyers in the Chinese Navy. The Sunburn is designed to overcome cruise missile defenses by rising above the target and slamming down through the deck of an aircraft carrier.
"The capabilities described above constitute 'deterrence by denial' and should be viewed in a larger context of China's deterrence of U.S. aircraft carrier groups in order to seize the island with the least bloodshed and physical damage," Lin said.
The United States is not without options. The U.S. Navy is armed with Standard SM-3 missiles and attempts will be made to deny Chinese access to GPS during a conflict. China's positioning satellites, the geosynchronous Beidou, do not cover the western Pacific.
However, Lin said China's possession of an ASBM will throw a wrench into Washington's decision-making apparatus on what to do about the eruption of a Taiwan Strait crisis.
"To intervene or not to intervene, that is the question. While the U.S. National Security Council is deliberating with hesitancy, the PLA can seize Taiwan with its conventional forces in a quick war of paralysis rather than annihilation," Lin said.
"The still larger context which I have mentioned is that the top priority of Beijing on Taiwan is to 'absorb without war.' The military option is the lowest, but under aggressive and speedy preparation. However, even the military option has never been to 'strike the U.S. and to destroy Taiwan,' but rather 'to deter the U.S. and to seize Taiwan' intact as much as possible."
Could the U.S. Intervene?
Stokes said a "question many friends in Taiwan have asked is whether or not the United States would intervene, should the PRC use force against Taiwan. As time goes on, it may become more of a question of could the U.S. intervene with sufficient alacrity before being handed a fait accompli."
Paul Giarra, a retired U.S. naval officer, strategic planner and defense analyst, believes it is debatable whether the U.S. Navy's visions for fleet ballistic missile defense plans will be sufficient to meet this threat.
"This points to a strategic-operational campaign of slow reduction of Chinese operational capabilities from great distance, over a considerable period of time, rather than a rapidly concluded attack from forward positions with the advantage of exterior lines of communication and freedom of the seas," he said.
"Since the Air Force sneezes when the Navy catches cold in the Asia-Pacific aerospace theater of operations, this Chinese capability thereby will make it difficult for the U.S. military to operate close enough to employ not only its naval surface fleet, but its land-based air power as well, Giarra said. Chinese multiple-warhead [anti-ballistic missiles] will necessitate significant technical and operational responses on the part of the American military."
"While history does not repeat, it does rhyme. A Chinese ASBM scenario would appear to bring us back to early 1942, and the start of the long advance on Tokyo."
http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?i=3307277
Doc Mercer
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
The Chinese will meet their match if they dare take on Canada with EOG's
version of Sgt York up there defending the FATHERLAND from that 2,000,000
man army
The Chinese will meet their match if they dare take on Canada with EOG's
version of Sgt York up there defending the FATHERLAND from that 2,000,000
man army
PassTheRock
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
Don't worry...Obama will send Kim one of those digital picture frames and smoothe the whole thing out.
Don't worry...Obama will send Kim one of those digital picture frames and smoothe the whole thing out.
Doc Mercer
EOG Master
Re: North Korea just launched its missle ... this should be good
He is gonna send Jong a picture of you fucking Rice to show that America
is indeed the Land of Hope and Opportunity
He is gonna send Jong a picture of you fucking Rice to show that America
is indeed the Land of Hope and Opportunity