How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Yep, I've always chuckled at the tailers feverishly writing down the contestants' picks like they were gospel.

On any given weekend, season, or lifetime, you're just as likely to do better with your own picks than theirs.

I do find it entertaining, however, and would like to see the format and the industry gathering point of the associated show return.
 

VegasRandy

EOG Veteran
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

The days of the 'big names' are over. everyone with a computer and a datbase knows more than those guys do.

I remember when the big sell was 'INSIDE information', then when that petered out it was "I am the best HANDICAPPER ever, now that everyone can handicap and get the same data, these guys new sales pitch is "I know the MARKET". The evolution of tout scum is amazing so once people figure out there is no real market and the supposed line moves that are supposed to give guys valued are totally meaningless, they will make up something else to sell to the saps who try and make money betting sports.

So basically anyone putting money up to bet against someone that a bunch of other degenerates lifted to 'stardom' is a little dumb. Because beating them one on one or even in a round robin type format isnt going to prove anything. There are more than enough contests around where you can take on all comers and if you win just claim you beat a bunch of 'big name' guys.

No I was a gambler not a tourney guy. Tournies are good for people who like to play make believe. Basically it is like playing the lottery. Now to be fair some of them do give out lucrative pay outs for next to nothing, and I did the Hilton a couple times in the late 90s and early 2000s. But for the most part that thing was a stepping stone for guys looking to go tout so it got boring. Plus the way it works is a total joke, but a guy paid my way a few years so I did it with him.

But watching and listening to those things is the same as watching my man Barry Chappell sell his art on TV. Good for entertainment and when he loses his mind about something. I never ever watched or listened to a contest for advise or looking to get an advantage or an angle. Because like I siad back in the day they spouted a bunch of trends and used them as evidence for picking one team over another. But I had those and many more so they werent telling me anything I couldnt find out myself. Now they mention the trends a little bit, but now, as i said, try and focus on the line or the price more as a reason to take a team or not. Which is also something anyone can do, especially if they have a decent line service. So unless they were total scum and saying the crazy shit Stu Feiner used to say I didnt care.

4Moi- Speaking truth on back to back post. You and I are on the exact same page. Well said.
 

rainbow

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

The days of the 'big names' are over. everyone with a computer and a datbase knows more than those guys do.

I remember when the big sell was 'INSIDE information', then when that petered out it was "I am the best HANDICAPPER ever, now that everyone can handicap and get the same data, these guys new sales pitch is "I know the MARKET". The evolution of tout scum is amazing so once people figure out there is no real market and the supposed line moves that are supposed to give guys valued are totally meaningless, they will make up something else to sell to the saps who try and make money betting sports.

So basically anyone putting money up to bet against someone that a bunch of other degenerates lifted to 'stardom' is a little dumb. Because beating them one on one or even in a round robin type format isnt going to prove anything. There are more than enough contests around where you can take on all comers and if you win just claim you beat a bunch of 'big name' guys.
I totally dissagree with you quoted about everyone gets the same DATA, EVERYONE wish they had the same DATA as BW... HOW MANY ORGINATORS DO YOU THINK THEY HAVE IN THIS INDUSTRY? You talk like they have MILLIONS of ORIGINATORS, when its only a HANDFUL... I've been in this BUSINESS for a very LONGTIME and practically know all of them and which guys to RESPECT and which one's not to RESPECT. NOWAY JOSE does EVERYONE have the same DATA and they still do have inside INFO, its just not BROADCASTED at the EOG or on the front page of the sports page. Just my .02...
 
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

I totally dissagree with you quoted about everyone gets the same DATA, EVERYONE wish they had the same DATA as BW... HOW MANY ORGINATORS DO YOU THINK THEY HAVE IN THIS INDUSTRY? You talk like they have MILLIONS of ORIGINATORS, when its only a HANDFUL... I've been in this BUSINESS for a very LONGTIME and practically know all of them and which guys to RESPECT and which one's not to RESPECT. NOWAY JOSE does EVERYONE have the same DATA and they still do have inside INFO, its just not BROADCASTED at the EOG or on the front page of the sports page. Just my .02...


Was wondering how long it would be before BW jock sniffer turned up. You help to perpetuate more myth and fantasy than anyone on the forums. But it feeds right into to exactly what I talk about. BW had a couple computer geeks doing stuff for him before doing it was the mainstream, that is about all that can be said. To think he gets more data or info than anyone else in this day and age is laughable. But keep trying to convince yourselves and others that he is even relevant anymore. Because everything he did ANYONE with a few grand could do. Maybe not to the extent (for a short period of time) but anyone could move aline with a serious bet, something you cant do anymore because everyone moves on air and no one takes bets large enough from a single person to actually effect a line. Other than maybe a few syndicates with an established clientele (only because they know a lot of people will take that game regardless) do books move on someones opinion.

You guys all keep forgetting I know exactly how BW made his first money because I have been around just about as long, and I know/knew guys who probably forgot more then you will ever know about the guy because they actually hung around him and knew what he was like. That all ended quite a long time ago. But like I say it makes for a good story. But I figured it was way overdue that a BW comment hadnt been made yet. But since he never did contests too much either it was a moot point to begin with.
 

John Kelly

Born Gambler
Staff member
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Legend has it BW made $3.8 million on a crooked roulette wheel in Atlantic City.

True or false, wantitall?
 

FISHHEAD

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

As most know, game for any contest if it presents a +EV oppurtunity and the entry fee is no more $10,000.............................:cheers
 

Tuckman

Uh Poster
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Fish you made it out to Vegas permanently yet? I wll shoot you a pm with a few details this evening, same with you dodge
 

Timely Hero

Jacoby Blows
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Was wondering how long it would be before BW jock sniffer turned up. You help to perpetuate more myth and fantasy than anyone on the forums. But it feeds right into to exactly what I talk about. BW had a couple computer geeks doing stuff for him before doing it was the mainstream, that is about all that can be said. To think he gets more data or info than anyone else in this day and age is laughable. But keep trying to convince yourselves and others that he is even relevant anymore. Because everything he did ANYONE with a few grand could do. Maybe not to the extent (for a short period of time) but anyone could move aline with a serious bet, something you cant do anymore because everyone moves on air and no one takes bets large enough from a single person to actually effect a line. Other than maybe a few syndicates with an established clientele (only because they know a lot of people will take that game regardless) do books move on someones opinion.

You guys all keep forgetting I know exactly how BW made his first money because I have been around just about as long, and I know/knew guys who probably forgot more then you will ever know about the guy because they actually hung around him and knew what he was like. That all ended quite a long time ago. But like I say it makes for a good story. But I figured it was way overdue that a BW comment hadnt been made yet. But since he never did contests too much either it was a moot point to begin with.
Locals still fear Walters beards around Vegas - unless they have outs they can tail him at. I know this because my gramps was just in town for the 4th, and you sound unbelievably ignorant. Most, if they catch onto the Walters beard, will then bet his plays elsewhere themselves. He still wins a ton of money which is why he lives in a multi-million dollar home and why he still wagers extremely large sums at a successful rate. Yeah, "Anyone" could have done what he did. My lord...

Wantitall knows all apparently. Just read his drawn out posts telling everyone else how wrong they are.
 

rainbow

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Legend has it BW made $3.8 million on a crooked roulette wheel in Atlantic City.

True or false, wantitall?
And thats PEANUTS to what he WON betting PERIOD... Put it this way he didn't build those golf courses from a roulette wheel, and I could careless what Wanti thinks, ask Ironlock how much Wanti knows...
 

rainbow

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Was wondering how long it would be before BW jock sniffer turned up. You help to perpetuate more myth and fantasy than anyone on the forums. But it feeds right into to exactly what I talk about. BW had a couple computer geeks doing stuff for him before doing it was the mainstream, that is about all that can be said. To think he gets more data or info than anyone else in this day and age is laughable. But keep trying to convince yourselves and others that he is even relevant anymore. Because everything he did ANYONE with a few grand could do. Maybe not to the extent (for a short period of time) but anyone could move aline with a serious bet, something you cant do anymore because everyone moves on air and no one takes bets large enough from a single person to actually effect a line. Other than maybe a few syndicates with an established clientele (only because they know a lot of people will take that game regardless) do books move on someones opinion.

You guys all keep forgetting I know exactly how BW made his first money because I have been around just about as long, and I know/knew guys who probably forgot more then you will ever know about the guy because they actually hung around him and knew what he was like. That all ended quite a long time ago. But like I say it makes for a good story. But I figured it was way overdue that a BW comment hadnt been made yet. But since he never did contests too much either it was a moot point to begin with.

Smartest better EVER, and still is in a CLASS all alone... You are a good poster but you know ABSOLUTELY ZILCH about this man... Being HONEST I think you have him confused with yourself...LOL...
 
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Legend has it BW made $3.8 million on a crooked roulette wheel in Atlantic City.

True or false, wantitall?

Partially true. Some of the particulars are wrong.

Guys win and lose, he is no exception. He just used his own (ill gotten gains) to work for him. But anyone that thinks Billy Walters can pick one way action and not lose is a frigging idiot. That's exactly why he built those golf courses and invested in other 'legit' endeavors. because it was a safer investment. The way guys talk about him here he should never ever have to do anything but pick winners and give runners money hand over fist 24/7 and he would own the whole city of Vegas by now.

I never said the guy wasnt smart, or maybe even slightly ahead of his time, but what he did is no different than what a lot of other people tried to do or did do, but didnt get the notoriety for it. And since we will never ever know exactly what he did do or what was just attributed to him through lies and people swearing to it the full truth will never be known. But it doesnt really matter anyway people are going to believe what they want.

Casey Anthony walked out of a jail last night and half the people in the US think the jury (one following the rules this country was built upon about 235 years ago) was wrong. And we all saw that shit play out on TV and heard everything, and people still cant agree on it. So how can we expect anyone to agree on lies, tall tales, guys getting credit for stuff other people did, and a whole other passel of stuff surrounding a taboo pass time?
 

Timely Hero

Jacoby Blows
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Guys win and lose, he is no exception. He just used his own (ill gotten gains) to work for him. But anyone that thinks Billy Walters can pick one way action and not lose is a frigging idiot. That's exactly why he built those golf courses and invested in other 'legit' endeavors. because it was a safer investment. The way guys talk about him here he should never ever have to do anything but pick winners and give runners money hand over fist 24/7 and he would own the whole city of Vegas by now.

This entire paragraph contradicts itself so badly it's funny.

So he won enough to build golf courses and buy other expensive things to invest in, but if he could pick winners that's all he would have to do - then you go on to say if he picked winners he would own all of Vegas? What? So he's won so much that he is investing in very expensive endeavors (building golf courses), but he shouldn't have to do that if he's picking so many winners and if he did pick winners he'd own Vegas? :blink: Is he supposed to buy stuff or not?

That point is also dumb to begin with. That's like saying if a Lawyer was a great Lawyer, why would he invest in bonds and the stock market? You invest in other things to spread your money out and protect yourself.
 

pvcpipe

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

TH,

The key to the post you quoted is "one-way action." BW bets both sides. So it's not really a matter of picking winners, and I think that's what he was trying to say. I don't think this diminishes his accomplishments, though.
 

Heim

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Saw the 60 Minute piece again tonight on Walters. Still love listening to his Southern style rant about Wall Street and how they hustled 'The Great Hustler' out of millions. Don't fret Billy Vegas has their own hustlers every Saturday morning on the USA network called "Proline'......
 

John Kelly

Born Gambler
Staff member
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Lara Logan, the journalist handling the 60 Minutes piece, missed a great follow-up question after Billy Walters said, "In this world, you're either a hustler or you're getting hustled."

The obvious follow-up question (Which one are you, Billy?) was never asked.

Tsk-tsk.
 

Timely Hero

Jacoby Blows
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

TH,

The key to the post you quoted is "one-way action." BW bets both sides. So it's not really a matter of picking winners, and I think that's what he was trying to say. I don't think this diminishes his accomplishments, though.
No different than any other investments people make. Sometimes you set stops in the market to protect yourself, and sometimes in sports betting you hedge or play both sides to g'tee a profit. If everyone could do it, and own golf courses (as Want implies throughout this thread), then they would do it. The fact is, acting as if Walters was just in the right place at the right time and acting as if he's doing nothing different than tons of other sports bettors is simply ignorant.
 

Viejo Dinosaur

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Lara Logan, the journalist handling the 60 Minutes piece, missed a great follow-up question after Billy Walters said, "In this world, you're either a hustler or you're getting hustled."

The obvious follow-up question (Which one are you, Billy?) was never asked.

Tsk-tsk.

He trys to play the hustler role...he cheats at golf and is not a very nice person...the PGA does not let him play anymore pro/guest tournaments because he lied about his handicap....
 

rainbow

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Lara Logan, the journalist handling the 60 Minutes piece, missed a great follow-up question after Billy Walters said, "In this world, you're either a hustler or you're getting hustled."

The obvious follow-up question (Which one are you, Billy?) was never asked.

Tsk-tsk.
I can answer this question he sure isn't getting hustled... He not only has the best data base but if a game is -6.5 everywhere and he wants to take +7 don't worry he will get it.... I can't count how many times you could look at a closing line on a game and you couldn't tell if he was involved or not on that particular game... He bets a lot off the screen only and plays around on games betting both sides for the people that is trying to track his games... I can't even describe in words how smart he is... Do I like the man? never did and he knows I don't like him, but that sure doesn't mean I don't respect him over any better in the world by far...
 

John Kelly

Born Gambler
Staff member
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

I wonder if Billy Walters bets games with pre-determined outcomes.

If he supposedly buys politicians and City Council members, hustles golf and allegedly cheats at roulette, I don't think it's a reach to wonder if BW or one of his associates would approach a coach, referee or player.
 

Tuckman

Uh Poster
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Nice to see this took a life of it's own :doh1
 
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

Really, lol. So is Billy Walters going to be in the contest and on the show? : ^)

We were talking at one point about the fallibility of touts (and humans) in general in a given weekend in this basic contest format, then . . . .

Never would consider Walters to be a tout. I'll listen fer sure if ya'll get him on, lol.
 

pvcpipe

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

I wonder if Billy Walters bets games with pre-determined outcomes.

If he supposedly buys politicians and City Council members, hustles golf and allegedly cheats at roulette, I don't think it's a reach to wonder if BW or one of his associates would approach a coach, referee or player.


I tried to cheat at roulette by telling the dealer her shoelaces were untied, then moving the ball when she looked down.

Casinos have no sense of humor.
 
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

No different than any other investments people make. Sometimes you set stops in the market to protect yourself, and sometimes in sports betting you hedge or play both sides to g'tee a profit. If everyone could do it, and own golf courses (as Want implies throughout this thread), then they would do it. The fact is, acting as if Walters was just in the right place at the right time and acting as if he's doing nothing different than tons of other sports bettors is simply ignorant.


It was the way the whole system used to be. You guys are either really young or dont remember what sportsbetting was like even in say 1998. In the past decade or so it is almost a different business altogether. and he was doing it before it got out of the dinosaur stages, but he did use the 'new fangled' approaches they used against them. As did others.

Also if people think guys didnt use his action against him youre deluded too. Guys would get some info on what he was doing and buy back before he could. that would have been a miuch better question to ask. So while he might not have gotten hustled per se, he surely got used a few times. But what goes around comes around. he surely used plenty of stogges he knew to his advatantage.

The artist formally known as Shrink was one of the best. Or Shrink told stories about what the plays were. Either way he (shrink) sure lost his mind a few of the times we called him on posting phoney 'BW plays" and he swore up and down we were wrong. Latest and greatest was Colts V Saints in the Sb a couple years ago. Shrink swore up and down Billy was on the Colts. But from what I remember everyone and their mother was on the Saints. And that was why Shrink claimed BW was the other way. So someone was lying or getting used there. But in this business who can you really trust? And does it really matter. Shrink used the name a lot and the fact he had done some favors for te guy a few times to help build himslef up quite a bit over the years. So once again using names and dropping make believe reputations to scam suckers out of money.

As for how much he made. Starting with a 3 million+ bankroll and making a guaranteed profit everyday on it would tend to make a decent living. And of course he made a lot of money, a lot of guys did for awhile. But it wasnt never ending, and he got out while the getting was good, for the most part. And not all the money he used to go legit was from gambling, he just got a few backers enticed with his cash heavy holdings, and they in turn helped him get some credit. And the rest is history.

Like I said the fairy tale is much better than the truth. But the truth really isnt all that bad either. But being a millionaire a few times over just isnt as romantic to degenerates unless he made it all from beating the books. Which in and of itself is a dumb statement. But that is another lesson for another time.
 
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

I wonder if Billy Walters bets games with pre-determined outcomes.

If he supposedly buys politicians and City Council members, hustles golf and allegedly cheats at roulette, I don't think it's a reach to wonder if BW or one of his associates would approach a coach, referee or player.


Yeah that transformer explosion in the las vegas bowl in 2002 (I think) was natural causes.
 

rainbow

EOG Master
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

It was the way the whole system used to be. You guys are either really young or dont remember what sportsbetting was like even in say 1998. In the past decade or so it is almost a different business altogether. and he was doing it before it got out of the dinosaur stages, but he did use the 'new fangled' approaches they used against them. As did others.

Also if people think guys didnt use his action against him youre deluded too. Guys would get some info on what he was doing and buy back before he could. that would have been a miuch better question to ask. So while he might not have gotten hustled per se, he surely got used a few times. But what goes around comes around. he surely used plenty of stogges he knew to his advatantage.

The artist formally known as Shrink was one of the best. Or Shrink told stories about what the plays were. Either way he (shrink) sure lost his mind a few of the times we called him on posting phoney 'BW plays" and he swore up and down we were wrong. Latest and greatest was Colts V Saints in the Sb a couple years ago. Shrink swore up and down Billy was on the Colts. But from what I remember everyone and their mother was on the Saints. And that was why Shrink claimed BW was the other way. So someone was lying or getting used there. But in this business who can you really trust? And does it really matter. Shrink used the name a lot and the fact he had done some favors for te guy a few times to help build himslef up quite a bit over the years. So once again using names and dropping make believe reputations to scam suckers out of money.

As for how much he made. Starting with a 3 million+ bankroll and making a guaranteed profit everyday on it would tend to make a decent living. And of course he made a lot of money, a lot of guys did for awhile. But it wasnt never ending, and he got out while the getting was good, for the most part. And not all the money he used to go legit was from gambling, he just got a few backers enticed with his cash heavy holdings, and they in turn helped him get some credit. And the rest is history.

Like I said the fairy tale is much better than the truth. But the truth really isnt all that bad either. But being a millionaire a few times over just isnt as romantic to degenerates unless he made it all from beating the books. Which in and of itself is a dumb statement. But that is another lesson for another time.
I have no idea who you are referring to being young, its nothing you can tell me about this business that I don't already know. I started out in this business in the 1970's, offshore for over 20yrs and worked for several major books. Its nothing you can tell me about BW that I don't already know... Is he by far the SMARTEST BETTER right now? I will answer this question for you, he will always be in a class by himself till he retires. If you booked him right now with your own money and booked him high, by the end of college hoops you would be borrowing money to pay him off, that I would bet high on...
 

Bagiant

EOG Dedicated
Re: How many High Stakes EOG Posters would pony up a nice sum of cash to take on the biggest names in the industry?

I'll take on all comers!
 
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