Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Bill Laimbeer!
Birdie always good for a chuckle.
Bill Laimbeer!
Birdie always good for a chuckle.
NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
- Thread starter MadCapper
- Start date
munson15
I want winners...
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
The Philadelphia cable station ran the entire game 2 as part of their 'greatest games' series just the other night. Portland got blown out in Philadelphia, but late in game 2, with the play getting very chippy, Dawkins goes after small forward Bob Gross of all people and Lucas attacks from the other side of the court after Dawkins threw a punch which actually bloodied his teammate Doug Collins. Dawkins and Lucas square off like two boxers, a couple of harmless blows were landed, and a near riot ensued. The Sixers lost 4 straight afterwards and it's been theorized that Lucas' defending his team's honor vs. the gigantic Dawkins galvanized the Blazers. Quite a moment, and I recall watching it at the time thinking that Portland would not be bullied, but could not win the series vs. all that talent (Erving, McGinnis, Free, Collins, etc.).
TomBrady#1
EOG Dedicated
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Phili had loads of talent but did not play as a team. Portland did not have as much talent but very much played like a team. This series turned around in a big way. It was great to watch. George McGinnis was called a choker and he sure had a horrible series. He kept shooting and missing and shooting and missing......
Phili had loads of talent but did not play as a team. Portland did not have as much talent but very much played like a team. This series turned around in a big way. It was great to watch. George McGinnis was called a choker and he sure had a horrible series. He kept shooting and missing and shooting and missing......
TomBrady#1
EOG Dedicated
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Yeah isn't that off the charts? I mean 21-23 in the final four. He only lost like 1 game or so in his 4 years in college (something like that). AMAZING. In the NBA he was so good on offense and defense all while being a total team player. HE blocked shots, had that sweet jump hook, and could pass like nobody else from center position. Very very few did it on both ends of the floor like that. Russell was DEFENSE...Kareem was offense etc etc.....
Yeah isn't that off the charts? I mean 21-23 in the final four. He only lost like 1 game or so in his 4 years in college (something like that). AMAZING. In the NBA he was so good on offense and defense all while being a total team player. HE blocked shots, had that sweet jump hook, and could pass like nobody else from center position. Very very few did it on both ends of the floor like that. Russell was DEFENSE...Kareem was offense etc etc.....
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
He was 21 - 22 for 44 points and 13 rebounds in that Championship game
:btj:
He was 21 - 22 for 44 points and 13 rebounds in that Championship game
:btj:
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
and UCLA covered -13.5 getting me out of a huge trap! This was the first Championship game played on Monday Night. I was supposed to settle with my bookie on Tuesday. :btj:
LCD
2
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
I think Dawkins tore apart the dressing room after he was kicked. Lucas went up to shake his hand at the start of the next game didn't he to completely mindcrush him.
Musberger getting hysterical. Lol you fight in Philly fans come on the floor and want to get in on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKC-FjW-9_c
I think Dawkins tore apart the dressing room after he was kicked. Lucas went up to shake his hand at the start of the next game didn't he to completely mindcrush him.
Musberger getting hysterical. Lol you fight in Philly fans come on the floor and want to get in on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKC-FjW-9_c
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Those Sixer teams always choked in the playoffs during the late 70's and early 80's until they got Moses.
McGinnis, Erving, Dawkins, C. Jones, Collins, World B. Free, B. Jones, Cheeks, Hollins, Bibby and the great Steve Mix.
Joe Bryant (kobe's dad) and Mike Dunleavy (Mike Dunleavy's dad) were on that 1977 team that lost to the Blazers. And Harvey Catchings was also on that team (Tamika Catching's dad)
They always seemed to back down when the going got tough.... Lebrons problem :+clueless ?
I watched many a Sixer playoff game in the front row including Magics night when they won the NBA Championship.
Hated the Sixers :houra
Those Sixer teams always choked in the playoffs during the late 70's and early 80's until they got Moses.
McGinnis, Erving, Dawkins, C. Jones, Collins, World B. Free, B. Jones, Cheeks, Hollins, Bibby and the great Steve Mix.
Joe Bryant (kobe's dad) and Mike Dunleavy (Mike Dunleavy's dad) were on that 1977 team that lost to the Blazers. And Harvey Catchings was also on that team (Tamika Catching's dad)
They always seemed to back down when the going got tough.... Lebrons problem :+clueless ?
I watched many a Sixer playoff game in the front row including Magics night when they won the NBA Championship.
Hated the Sixers :houra
Timely Hero
Jacoby Blows
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Walton being on the list is an absolute joke, and I've said that many times before. This is 50 greatest NBA players, not college players. Injuries and longevity are part of what makes you great.
There have been tons of incredibly gifted and great college players who aren't on the list.
Walton being on the list is an absolute joke, and I've said that many times before. This is 50 greatest NBA players, not college players. Injuries and longevity are part of what makes you great.
There have been tons of incredibly gifted and great college players who aren't on the list.
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Not sure why some people think Barkley should get bumped I'm not as familiar with advanced basketball metrics as I am with baseball ones but I'm pretty sure most of the advanced basketball metrics would have Barkley in the top 25 of all time, let alone top 50. He averaged almost 12 rebounds a game while scoring 22 points per game, which puts him in pretty elite company.
If Shaq was already on the list as of 96-97, it isn't a stretch to put Chris Paul on the list. Depending on whether this list was made before or after the 96-97 season, at the time, Shaq only had 4 or 5 seasons under his belt, whereas Chris Paul now has 5 full season and 2 partial ones, so basically 6 full seasons, and routinely appears right at the top of the list of the most valuable players by the advanced metrics. I was surprised when he started appearing so high on the list a few years back, but when you're right at the top among the leaders in steals and assists, that's quite valuable.
Most of Madcappers definite additions are no-brainers with the exception of Iverson, probably the most overrated player of the last decade. Reggie Miller obviously belongs and probably and Ray Allen and Paul Pierce. Dave Bing, Nate Thurmond and James Worthy are among the most obvious bumps.
Not sure why some people think Barkley should get bumped I'm not as familiar with advanced basketball metrics as I am with baseball ones but I'm pretty sure most of the advanced basketball metrics would have Barkley in the top 25 of all time, let alone top 50. He averaged almost 12 rebounds a game while scoring 22 points per game, which puts him in pretty elite company.
If Shaq was already on the list as of 96-97, it isn't a stretch to put Chris Paul on the list. Depending on whether this list was made before or after the 96-97 season, at the time, Shaq only had 4 or 5 seasons under his belt, whereas Chris Paul now has 5 full season and 2 partial ones, so basically 6 full seasons, and routinely appears right at the top of the list of the most valuable players by the advanced metrics. I was surprised when he started appearing so high on the list a few years back, but when you're right at the top among the leaders in steals and assists, that's quite valuable.
Most of Madcappers definite additions are no-brainers with the exception of Iverson, probably the most overrated player of the last decade. Reggie Miller obviously belongs and probably and Ray Allen and Paul Pierce. Dave Bing, Nate Thurmond and James Worthy are among the most obvious bumps.
Timely Hero
Jacoby Blows
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
I love Jason Kidd, and he's a Hall of Fame player, but I'm not sure he's one of the 50 greatest. Shooting 40% for his career is just too troubling. The rest you listed are for sure. I'd simply replace Kidd with Nash. The rest of your ? players aren't there yet and I love Wade. I'd say he probably is, but it's really close.
I love Jason Kidd, and he's a Hall of Fame player, but I'm not sure he's one of the 50 greatest. Shooting 40% for his career is just too troubling. The rest you listed are for sure. I'd simply replace Kidd with Nash. The rest of your ? players aren't there yet and I love Wade. I'd say he probably is, but it's really close.
Timely Hero
Jacoby Blows
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Barkley is easily top 50. It's not even up for discussion I didn't think.
Barkley is easily top 50. It's not even up for discussion I didn't think.
KingRevolver
Born Rambler
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Exactly.
Exactly.
Doughy
2
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Duncan > Barkley > Wade > Kidd > Paul > your neighborhood mailman > Walton.
I give Barkley a very slight edge over Wade and expect Wade to surpass Barkley by the time his career his done. But...if Wade never played another game I put Barkley ahead of him right now for his body of work.
Duncan > Barkley > Wade > Kidd > Paul > your neighborhood mailman > Walton.
I give Barkley a very slight edge over Wade and expect Wade to surpass Barkley by the time his career his done. But...if Wade never played another game I put Barkley ahead of him right now for his body of work.
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
You really think Kidd is better than Paul? I would disagree with that 100%
And I will say it one last time...
There's a reason Bill Walton is on that list.... Not one of those players on the list or any person that helped make that list would ever think of NOT including Walton.
He simply was one of the greatest Centers EVER....
op:
You really think Kidd is better than Paul? I would disagree with that 100%
And I will say it one last time...
There's a reason Bill Walton is on that list.... Not one of those players on the list or any person that helped make that list would ever think of NOT including Walton.
He simply was one of the greatest Centers EVER....
op:High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Connie Hawkins should also be on the list
Connie Hawkins should also be on the list
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
They were fun to watch and follow even though I actually hated them.
I loved it when they (and the Flyers) chocked every year come playoff time.
Philly has had some pretty good teams over the years in all sports but have very little to show for it. Thus the reason Philly fans are as crazy as they are.
I would imagine they are in love with the Phillies these days.....
op:
They were fun to watch and follow even though I actually hated them.
I loved it when they (and the Flyers) chocked every year come playoff time.
Philly has had some pretty good teams over the years in all sports but have very little to show for it. Thus the reason Philly fans are as crazy as they are.
I would imagine they are in love with the Phillies these days.....
op:Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Hawkins was a shadow of himself when he entered the NBA at almost 28 years old.
Doughy
2
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Yes, I believe Kidd's body of work is better than Paul's right this second in a vacuum. I don't discount longevity nor the fact that Kidd has a championship and Paul doesn't. If Paul never were to play another game, Kidd's career easily trumps his. However, if Paul keeps up what he's doing then he could very well surpass Kidd in my mind. I need to see a few more seasons from him before I could say he's more belonging than Kidd.You really think Kidd is better than Paul? I would disagree with that 100%
And I will say it one last time...
There's a reason Bill Walton is on that list.... Not one of those players on the list or any person that helped make that list would ever think of NOT including Walton.
He simply was one of the greatest Centers EVER....
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
It's called the 50 "Greatest players"op:
Not 50 best careers
I think that's what some of you are missing here.
If Kareem had retired after 2 years he would have to be included in the list because he was one of the 50 greatest NBA basketball players. Some players are obvious top 50.
It's called the 50 "Greatest players"
op:Not 50 best careers
I think that's what some of you are missing here.
If Kareem had retired after 2 years he would have to be included in the list because he was one of the 50 greatest NBA basketball players. Some players are obvious top 50.
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
I agree with that thought HT. I think it's a mixture of both. I think you have to look at each player's peak, but they had to have proven it over a fair amount of years. A guy can't just play MVP level basketball for one year and get called 50 greatest
For me though it's no question that Chris Paul's best is better than jason kidd's best, and he has proven it long enough for me to easily include him in a top 50 list.
I agree with that thought HT. I think it's a mixture of both. I think you have to look at each player's peak, but they had to have proven it over a fair amount of years. A guy can't just play MVP level basketball for one year and get called 50 greatest
For me though it's no question that Chris Paul's best is better than jason kidd's best, and he has proven it long enough for me to easily include him in a top 50 list.
Doughy
2
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
You have to look at a player's whole career when deciding if he's in the top 50. Otherwise, maybe we'd have Robert Horry in this discussion because he was damn good in short spurts. Or maybe you would include Penny Hardaway, Grant Hill, or Tracy McGrady because they played like MVP's part of their careers.
Kidd is a HOF lock right now, Paul is not. Kidd has a championship, Paul does not. Paul's play over 6 or so years doesn't surpass Kidd's 15+ years to me, but to each his own.
You have to look at a player's whole career when deciding if he's in the top 50. Otherwise, maybe we'd have Robert Horry in this discussion because he was damn good in short spurts. Or maybe you would include Penny Hardaway, Grant Hill, or Tracy McGrady because they played like MVP's part of their careers.
Kidd is a HOF lock right now, Paul is not. Kidd has a championship, Paul does not. Paul's play over 6 or so years doesn't surpass Kidd's 15+ years to me, but to each his own.
KingRevolver
Born Rambler
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
:LMAO
It's called the 50 "Greatest players"
Not 50 best careers
I think that's what some of you are missing here.
If Kareem had retired after 2 years he would have to be included in the list because he was one of the 50 greatest NBA basketball players. Some players are obvious top 50.
:LMAO
KingRevolver
Born Rambler
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Good post.
Good post.
TomBrady#1
EOG Dedicated
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
I am not nearly as sold on Chris Paul as some. He is very talented but has won NOTHING. Someone will point to James but he carried a weak team to the finals, he took the Celtics to 7 dead even games the year we won it all...and more. Kidd did/does what a good PG will do and is very effective when it comes to WINNING (the name of the game). Paul while very talented has got to lead his team to the promised land. He is not in my top 50 YET. You got to prove it. Sorry but this is typical of society today that some want to annoint Chris Paul although he has never sniffed the finals or carry his team to the promised land or won anything at all.
I am not nearly as sold on Chris Paul as some. He is very talented but has won NOTHING. Someone will point to James but he carried a weak team to the finals, he took the Celtics to 7 dead even games the year we won it all...and more. Kidd did/does what a good PG will do and is very effective when it comes to WINNING (the name of the game). Paul while very talented has got to lead his team to the promised land. He is not in my top 50 YET. You got to prove it. Sorry but this is typical of society today that some want to annoint Chris Paul although he has never sniffed the finals or carry his team to the promised land or won anything at all.
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Give us a winner tonight you fauker
Give us a winner tonight you fauker
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Dave Cowens who should have been called for an offensive foul almost every time he took a hook shot should be dumped from the "top 50" list.
In fact he should not have been on the list in the first place.
Dave Cowens who should have been called for an offensive foul almost every time he took a hook shot should be dumped from the "top 50" list.
In fact he should not have been on the list in the first place.
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Now that you say it, I remember Cowens clearing the way for his goofy hook shot.
Now that you say it, I remember Cowens clearing the way for his goofy hook shot.
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Interesting distinction, HT.
It's called the 50 "Greatest players"
Not 50 best careers
I think that's what some of you are missing here.
If Kareem had retired after 2 years he would have to be included in the list because he was one of the 50 greatest NBA basketball players. Some players are obvious top 50.
Interesting distinction, HT.
High Times
EOG Master
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
This ^^^
Bernard King was definitely one of the top 50 players and should also be in the Hall of Fame. Bernard King for some reason has been ignored when it comes to great players but he was as great as they come at his best.
I would take Bernard King over a couple of those top 50 players.
I loved watching him play!
This ^^^
Bernard King was definitely one of the top 50 players and should also be in the Hall of Fame. Bernard King for some reason has been ignored when it comes to great players but he was as great as they come at his best.
I would take Bernard King over a couple of those top 50 players.
I loved watching him play!
FairWarning
Bells Beer Connoisseur
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
But Walton's career was too short.
Rick Barry should be in the Top 50
CP3 in the top50? check back in 4-5 years.
But Walton's career was too short.
Rick Barry should be in the Top 50
CP3 in the top50? check back in 4-5 years.
FairWarning
Bells Beer Connoisseur
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Agree.
Agree.
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
If memory serves, Rick Barry was being criticized for shooting too much so he went out the following season and led the league in assists.
Barry deserves Top 50 status.
If memory serves, Rick Barry was being criticized for shooting too much so he went out the following season and led the league in assists.
Barry deserves Top 50 status.
TomBrady#1
EOG Dedicated
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
I remember Pat Riley on one of those ESPN segments going over a classic game, and he was begrudgingly talking about how great Dave Cowens was. He talked about his heart and his effort and intensity and remember it was hard for him to talk about the enemy but he said about Cowens "That big Red head could play for me anytime". Again you are talking about a guy that was in and WON many many big games. Just a great ferocoious big time player who won many many big time games. I watched many of Cowens games. Again, like Walton, anyone who watched him play and has any basketball sense whatsoever, will never say he did not belong in the top 50. Nobody with an ounce of basketball sense will critize the great Dave Cowens. I saw him dominate Moses Malone, Frustrate Kareem and win big when it counted, He scored from inside and out and anyone who knows basketball loves Dave Cowens. Like Riley said, you can't deny him. I am from Boston and watched the Green all my life and to talk abotu Cowens fouling a lot is news to me. I have NEVER heard that. I guess that poster and John Kelly the moron agreed. Always a few morons but they fall on deaf ears. If you can't talk postive about Cowens after watching him (like him or not)....you are a sad case.
I remember Pat Riley on one of those ESPN segments going over a classic game, and he was begrudgingly talking about how great Dave Cowens was. He talked about his heart and his effort and intensity and remember it was hard for him to talk about the enemy but he said about Cowens "That big Red head could play for me anytime". Again you are talking about a guy that was in and WON many many big games. Just a great ferocoious big time player who won many many big time games. I watched many of Cowens games. Again, like Walton, anyone who watched him play and has any basketball sense whatsoever, will never say he did not belong in the top 50. Nobody with an ounce of basketball sense will critize the great Dave Cowens. I saw him dominate Moses Malone, Frustrate Kareem and win big when it counted, He scored from inside and out and anyone who knows basketball loves Dave Cowens. Like Riley said, you can't deny him. I am from Boston and watched the Green all my life and to talk abotu Cowens fouling a lot is news to me. I have NEVER heard that. I guess that poster and John Kelly the moron agreed. Always a few morons but they fall on deaf ears. If you can't talk postive about Cowens after watching him (like him or not)....you are a sad case.
munson15
I want winners...
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
Actually that was Wilt Chamberlain, but Barry, despite being a notorious ball-hog, was a great player. Wilt famously emulated Barry's underhanded free throw style, but never achieved the results (Barry would routinely hit over 90%). Barry has been 'punished' by writers and NBA types who never forgave him for jumping to the upstart ABA which fueled a tremendous rise in player salaries.
Re: NBA's 50 Greatest Players (List from 96-97)...Who joined and who was bumped off 15 years later?
The memory did not serve me well here.
The memory did not serve me well here.