Sports betting pushed

The General

Another Day, Another Dollar
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/local/story/350830p-299250c.html

Some elected city officials urged New York yesterday to take a gamble on legalizing sports betting - and help pump $1.9 billion a year into education.


City Councilman Tony Avella (D-Queens) introduced a resolution yesterday calling on Congress and the state Legislature to legalize sports betting and funnel its revenues into schools. Another supporter is Brooklyn District Attorney Charles Hynes, who said legalization is the only way to stop "an enormous drain" of money from ending up in the pockets of bookies and the mob.

Kathy Wylde, president and CEO of the Partnership for New York City, said the state could reap $1.9 billion a year from legalized sports betting. But the odds of change are long. In 1992, Congress banned states from legalizing sports gambling, while allowing it to continue where already legal.
 

David Matthews

EOG Enthusiast
I think it will happen in our lifetimes. I really do. The Federal law that prohibits sports betting in all but 4 states, Nevada, Oregon, Delaware and I think Wyoming (or is it Montana?), is clearly unconstitutional. You can't make a Federal law that gives some states rights that others don't have. State governments are going bankrupt and dying to find new sources of revenue. I think we'll see legal sports betting in other states within 6 years. Only thing is, I think the states will try to take too big of a cut. They'll pay 4 to 1 on 3-team parlays and stuff like that, so they still won't be able to compete with the locals and Internet. My prediction.
 

The General

Another Day, Another Dollar
It is nice to know there is a political view out there to debate the defiance. I am not certain how strong the Congress actually cares about gambling. Do you think they really study the issue or not? We all know the money to be made. At least my generation does. Is the Congress behind times?
 

David Matthews

EOG Enthusiast
Our Federal government is behind the times. No doubt about it. They don't understand gambling and our country is so huge that the economic impact of allowing gambling, Internet or otherwise, doesn't mean enough to them considering the lack of support from the Moral Majority and others. Right now the millions of dollars in contributions from the religious groups is more tangible than the economic benefits of allowing and regulating gambling. Their goal is to get reelected and not rock the boat. Radical change just doesn't work at the Federal level for a Senator or House Rep that is enjoying the country club life.

It's the states that are small enough, desparate enough financially, and quicker to embrace technological advances that will make the difference.

Allowing Internet gambling in a state would require some type of move from the Feds, but allowing sports betting wouldn't. All that is required is challenging the Federal Law which bans sports betting in 46 states. Even our conservative Supreme Court would acknowledge the law is unconstitutional. You either have to allow it in all 50 states or ban it in all 50.

New Jersey has been rumbling about challenging the Federal law. Now New York. Others will too. Probably the organized crime groups will try to stop it. They don't want legal sports betting anywhere. Will cost them a ton. That may be the biggest hurdle of all.

The fact that state governments are smaller, works in their, and our favor. They can be more progressive to change. And change they will.

But like I said, if it's state run like the lottery, they'll probably either give horrible parlay odds or charge -120 vig and such so only the absolute poorest and least informed people will pay. If not that, they will tax the industry heavily which will lead to similar bad odds from the private companies trying to run the business.

After a few states start doing it, one will decide to tax it lightly, allowing the sports books to offer competitive odds. But that's probably about 10 to 15 years down the road. I do think we'll see some form of sports betting in other states within 6 though.
 
outside of nv.........you will not see the day you can walk into a place a make a straight wager on a game........



lottery type, parlay type gambling like oregon has....yea maybe....but that is nowhere near what 99.9% of gamblers would like.....


atlantic city would kill to have sportsbetting.............but vegas would kill to keep atlantic city from every getting it.....or any other state......

wouldnt it be strange to see vegas sportsbooks sending huge amounts of cash to anti-gambling proponents, so they can scare the church going folk with tales of crime and addiction...let a proposed sportsbetting amendment get too far and thats what would happen..


the reality of the situation.. is that offshore gambling is in a precarious position too.......the government is trying to make it harder and harder to fund offshore accounts.........
 

David Matthews

EOG Enthusiast
bunyon said:
I agree 100% DPO.

I disagree because it doesn't have to do with Congress. Sports betting in another state like NY, NJ, or another will happen within a few years. Here's a history of why it's currently illegal for those states to allow it. Basically, it's what I said above. A clearly unconstitutional Federal act.

But the most amazing attempt by Congress to control Evil Gambling was Sen. Bill Bradley's "Professional and Amateur Sports Protection Act."

This 1992 law is so comprehensive that there is really not much left for Sen. McCain to attack. The Nevada sports books were exempted because they were operating legally under Nevada law. So the debate is only whether Congress should, as the current bill states, "prohibit high school and college sports gambling in all States including States where such gambling was permitted prior to 1991."

In the 1970s, the Delaware State Lottery starting taking bets on professional football games. The National Football League sued -- and lost! The NFL claimed that people might think it was endorsing gambling. More importantly, sports teams make a lot of money from their tradenames. The Lottery got around both those problems by having people bet on "Los Angeles" rather than on the "Rams."

The Oregon State Lottery followed and expanded the bets to include games of the National Basketball Association.

That was too much for Sen. Bradley, who had been a star with basketball's New York Knicks.

Sen. Bradley's Act is short and to the point. It makes it unlawful for "a governmental entity to sponsor, operate, advertise, promote, license or authorize by law or compact a lottery, sweepstakes or other betting, gambling, or wagering scheme based, directly or indirectly . . . on one or more competitive games in which amateur or professional athletes participate . . . or on one or more performances of such athletes in such games."

States with existing sports betting were grandfathered in.

This federal law was designed to prevent any new sports betting of any kind, with one exception. The casinos in New Jersey had enough political clout to get Congress to give them one year to get sports betting legalized in that state. But, Sen. Bradley, who also was from New Jersey, had even greater political power. He single-handedly prevented the issue of legalizing sports betting from even being put on the ballot; so the citizens of New Jersey never got to vote on the question.

The Bradley Act is a strange and even frightening federal law for anyone who knows American history.

The federal government had never before tried to regulate or prohibit gambling which took place entirely within a single state. In fact, it does not have the power to do so.

Following the American Revolution, the states decided to create a federal government with limited powers. Congress and the President may think they can do anything they want, but they only have powers given them by the U.S. Constitution.

I can find only two provisions of the Constitution which might apply. The first is Congress's power to regulate Interstate Commerce. But we are talking about purely intra-state activities. The Bradley Act prevents a state legislature from passing a state law that would allow a citizen of that state to make a legal sports bet with another citizen of that same state.

The other possible Constitutional provision is Congress's power to protect tradenames. But the Bradley Act allowed licensed sports books in Nevada to continue to use actual team names, as they had been doing for decades.

Never before did an Act of Congress so blatantly discriminate among the states.

Never before did an Act of Congress so restrict the right of states to raise revenue.

And never before did an Act of Congress give private organizations the power to enforce a federal law against a state. For the most frightening provision of the Bradley Act provides, "A civil action to enjoin [a state from legalizing sports betting] may be commenced . . .by the Attorney General of the United States, or by a professional sports organization or amateur sports organization whose competitive game is alleged to be the basis of [the wager]."

http://rose.casinocitytimes.com/articles/1015.html
 

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
I've enjoyed this thread. Both Matthews and dimeplayersonly have made valid points about the future.

I think (although they won't admit it publically) the offshore books hope it remains as it is in the US. Competition---not wanted.
 

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
The General said:
Is regulation the real way to go?

One of my all-time favorite tv shows used to be (and reruns too) THE WILD WILD WEST.

But. I know you guys at the EOG and other forums don't particularily want regulation, because..that would mean it's totally legal (with the so called gray area it has now) and then it would be Bye bye---forums. IMHO
 

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
The General said:
Even if regulated, we will need forums to discuss wagering whodat. :+clueless

General---I think highly of you man. I think you're a stand -up guy. But ask yourself this---Are the insurance companies of the US (who make money bye gambling----that YOU WON"T have an accident); want the government to take over the insurance business?

Ummmm---i think not:+signs8-1
 

The General

Another Day, Another Dollar
Why Thank ya Whodat. I have respect for you as well.


But if gambling was legalized, I will still be around posting on forums.

You can't take the junk out of a junkie. :+music1-6
 

Books Worst Enemy

EOG Addicted
If they govy isn't going to change the taxation of gambling profits I hope this doesn't pass.

Gambling losses do not carry forward to offset future years' winnings, unlike capital gains.

Anyone can tell you there will be losing years in the stock market, as well as winning years.

Gambling is no different. Some years you just break even, some years you clean up and some years you lose your ass. Just the way it works.

To pay taxes on the winning years and not be able to claim prior losses against those winnings is pure bullshit. At least with off shore, there is no 1099 sent to the IRS.

Later,
Books Worst Enemy
 

Scotty S

EOG Addicted
Kyl had the votes to pass his latest bill. If it had come to a vote it would have been passed. We dodged another bullet only because it didn't get to a vote. This intellectual twit will be back peddeling his nonsense and mabey one of these times he'll succeed. He ain't quiting.

Oregon dropped their parlay cards even though they were successful.

NJ had a chance to get grandfathered in but bowed to (D)Bill Bradley. Although it's a monster long shot NJ is still our best hope. It won't be NY.
 

mvbski

EOG Enthusiast
Scotty S said:
Oregon dropped their parlay cards even though they were successful.
The only reason they are doing away with the NFL in the lottery is because they wan't to host NCAA tournament games here not because of any pressure from the feds.In fact it was the tourist industry here that put the pressure on the state to drop it.
 

Scotty S

EOG Addicted
Good to hear from you buddy and your 100% correct. The point I was getting too is it's not moving in our direction. A state had a form of sports betting and dropped it.
 

Scotty S

EOG Addicted
While I'm at it Deleware dropped their form of sports betting also. Different reason of course, they got hammered, but never the less they also dropped it.
 

Whoson1st

EOG Dedicated
If it were legal--I think the books would use a higher medium (like Television) to advertize on. I saw an ad for Party Poker .com on ESPN2 a couple of nights ago. Wonder how much they paid for THAT?

For sure you'd hear more ads on radio.
 

mvbski

EOG Enthusiast
Scotty S said:
Good to hear from you buddy and your 100% correct. The point I was getting too is it's not moving in our direction. A state had a form of sports betting and dropped it.
Now that the lottery is out of the buisness lets say you and I open a old style Vegas book up here Scotty atleast we won't have to compete with the lottery.
 
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