An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Diety, Hell!! I think a fair case can be made that SANITY status is at issue. . . .
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

He's no more "fair and balanced" than any of the supporters of this invasion (it's not a war).

We invaded Kuwait to rescue a friend and continued into Iraq in 1991. We left with a clear cessation of hostilities NATO agreement. Saddam broke the rules by shooting upon our airplanes. That alone was enough legalities to invade.

Circa 1928 Churchill wanted to invade Germany under the
The Versailles Treaty
Treaty of Versailles

Sadly, he was thrown out of office and by 1938 Chamberlain had secured "Peace in our Time"
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

We invaded Kuwait to rescue a friend and continued into Iraq in 1991.

Incorrect. There was NO mutual defense treaty between the United States of America and the Kingdom of Kuwait.

We left with a clear cessation of hostilities NATO agreement.

Incorrect. It was never a NATO agreement, it was a UN resolution.


Saddam broke the rules by shooting upon our airplanes. That alone was enough legalities to invade.

Then I submit to you that this should have been given as a REASON in the Declaration of War asked for by President Bush. Wait a minute.... Bush never ASKED for a declaration of war... he asked for an unconstitutional "authorization or force" under bogus claims that Iraq had weapons of Mass destruction.


Circa 1928 Churchill wanted to invade Germany under the
The Versailles Treaty
Treaty of Versailles

Sadly, he was thrown out of office and by 1938 Chamberlain had secured "Peace in our Time"

Please don't be silly and compare Saddam Hussein (US installed and supported dictator) to Nazi Germany.
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Incorrect. It was never a NATO agreement, it was a UN resolution.

Sorry, I stand corrected. I meant the impotent UN but in a political discussion, it is my task to be clear, accurate and precise.

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by The Seer
We invaded Kuwait to rescue a friend and continued into Iraq in 1991.





</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Incorrect. There was NO mutual defense treaty between the United States of America and the Kingdom of Kuwait.
Must there be a pre-contract with all of our friendly nations? How will we ever help Darfur, etc.? It would be nice if we could stop the slaughter. I am not sure under what authority we entered Mogadishu in the 1990's but it was a crime to cut and run. One US serviceman's corpse being dragged through the streets was more the current White House occupant could stand. I go to Fort Benning sometimes and it is a standing joke "do the Rangers want to to back to Mogadishu?" Its used the same as "Does the bear crap in the woods?

Please don't be silly and compare Saddam Hussein (US installed and supported dictator) to Nazi Germany.
I think that is does not matter who puts in a killer for a leader. In Germany, it was the people. Were they mislead, of course! Did they enjoy the few years of prosperity between the wars? Again, of course. The Treaty was very hard on the German people and I think it taught the US leaders not to be so harsh with the victory over the Japs (Words of the times), my spell checker wanted me to change it.

I think that in a very real sense a person could say that the US brought on WWII by entering WWI. If we had obeyed the Monroe Doctrine, we would have stayed out of European Entanglements and the WWI should have ended with both sides "Bled white" and a mutually adequate treaty.

EDSITEment - Lesson Plan
Excellent reading above if you continue on some links.
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Quote:
<table border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset ;">Originally Posted by The Seer
We invaded Kuwait to rescue a friend and continued into Iraq in 1991.





</td></tr></tbody></table>

Must there be a pre-contract with all of our friendly nations? How will we ever help Darfur, etc.? It would be nice if we could stop the slaughter. I am not sure under what authority we entered Mogadishu in the 1990's but it was a crime to cut and run. One US serviceman's corpse being dragged through the streets was more the current White House occupant could stand. I go to Fort Benning sometimes and it is a standing joke "do the Rangers want to to back to Mogadishu?" Its used the same as "Does the bear crap in the woods?

In my opinion, yes there should be a treaty for mutual defense before even one US resource is committed. I'm not in favor of helping Darfur. Exactly how is the US threatened by Darfur?

The operation in Somalia was yet another UN led mission for humanitarian relief. My commander at my current unit when I arrived here was the Delta Force commander for that particular mission. If you watch the movie Black Hawk Down, he's the one that gives the mission go with "Irene". He never really liked to talk about that mission but did give me some insight that I will not repeat here or anywhere else out of my respect for him.

I think that is does not matter who puts in a killer for a leader. In Germany, it was the people. Were they mislead, of course! Did they enjoy the few years of prosperity between the wars? Again, of course. The Treaty was very hard on the German people and I think it taught the US leaders not to be so harsh with the victory over the Japs (Words of the times), my spell checker wanted me to change it.

I think it matters a great deal who puts a "Killer" in power and then supports them in their barbaric acts. Saddam Hussein was no warm and fuzzy world leader when Donald Rumsfeld shook his hand. It should teach the US the lesson that interventionism only creates blowback.

I think that in a very real sense a person could say that the US brought on WWII by entering WWI. If we had obeyed the Monroe Doctrine, we would have stayed out of European Entanglements and the WWI should have ended with both sides "Bled white" and a mutually adequate treaty.

EDSITEment - Lesson Plan
Excellent reading above if you continue on some links.

World War II was just a continuation of World War I.
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

In my opinion, yes there should be a treaty for mutual defense before even one US resource is committed.
Excellent point.
Exactly how is the US threatened by Darfur?
None, but Belgium never threatened us at all. We entered WWI because the President said "we can't just leave the defenceless Belgians to be slaughtered. Same in Darfur; in the 2004 election cycle there were ads on TV that made it look like it was Bush's fault the people of Darfur are being slaughtered.
If you watch the movie Black Hawk Down, he's the one that gives the mission go with "Irene".
I will watch it tonight.
World War II was just a continuation of World War I.
I was trying to say just that. Except I also wanted to emphasize that if WWI was fought to the bloody end by the combating Countries, it would have ended with no WWII, maybe not forever, but for longer than 20 years.

I think we have some things in common. I used to go to the Navy base in Tampa from 1999-2004. I lived in Cortez.
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

None, but Belgium never threatened us at all. We entered WWI because the President said "we can't just leave the defenceless Belgians to be slaughtered. Same in Darfur; in the 2004 election cycle there were ads on TV that made it look like it was Bush's fault the people of Darfur are being slaughtered.

So be it. Only the stupid will fall for such tricks.


I think we have some things in common. I used to go to the Navy base in Tampa from 1999-2004. I lived in Cortez.

Navy base? I'm unaware of a navy base here in Tampa. MacDill AFB, my station, is the only military base in the Tampa area.
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Again, another senior moment. I mean exactly that. Its been four years since I've been there. The little thing about being on a peninsula always made me think it was Navy. No insult taken, I hope to compare the USAF to the swabbies.
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

None, but Belgium never threatened us at all. We entered WWI because the President said "we can't just leave the defenceless Belgians to be slaughtered.

Belgium was not one of the Central Powers which we went to war with. The actual triggers of the United States' Declaration of War against Germany in April of 1917, was the resumption of unrestricted submarine warfare by the Germans, and the publication of the Zimmerman Telegram, wherein Germany attempted to enlist Mexico into declaring war against the U.S.
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Somehow, I always forget that Mexico thing. I was quoting what every Liberal says about every suffering person, persecuted people, or AIDS patient (now victim); "We can't just do nothing!" When these things fail, its "At least we tried, its not our fault."

I think I was paraphrasing what President Wilson was telling the people, but I would like further enlightenment on this subject.
Belgium was not one of the Central Powers which we went to war with.
I did not mean we went to war with them as in "we are in war with Iraqi" rather, we went to war to save Belgium.
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

We invaded Kuwait to rescue a friend and continued into Iraq in 1991. We left with a clear cessation of hostilities NATO agreement. Saddam broke the rules by shooting upon our airplanes. That alone was enough legalities to invade.

Circa 1928 Churchill wanted to invade Germany under the
The Versailles Treaty
Treaty of Versailles

Sadly, he was thrown out of office and by 1938 Chamberlain had secured "Peace in our Time"

DO SOME RESEARCH, START WITH APRIL GLASPIE.

April Glaspie - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

HotShotHarvey

EOG Veteran
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Thought that would shut your piehole KTB!!! It did!
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
McNuts

McNuts

Senator McNuts 2.25" Button


If finally found the source. Now I have learned something!
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

I will ask my old friend Pam T. who was in Iran for many years. As an Air Force wife, she had a high rank in the local society. When I asked her if she ever saw the Shaw, she said she went bowling with him often. Somewhat disbelieving, she answered in Farsi. It sounded like what I hear on TV.

April's story goes on; one part says this:


One version of the transcript has Glaspie saying:
We can see that you have deployed massive numbers of troops in the south. Normally that would be none of our business, but when this happens in the context of your threats against Kuwait, then it would be reasonable for us to be concerned. For this reason, I have received an instruction to ask you, in the spirit of friendship ? not confrontation ? regarding your intentions: Why are your troops massed so very close to Kuwait's borders?​


Another is this:​
The State Department never offered Glaspie another job requiring confirmation by the U.S. Senate. It never refuted or even commented on Baghdad?s misleading version of the Glaspie/Saddam conversation where Saddam tried, entirely dishonestly, to make it appear that the U.S. had not really opposed the Iraqi attack.​
In 1993, then-U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Madeleine Albright struck a gratuitously cruel blow against Glaspie when she ordered Ambassador Glaspie to be out of her office at the U.S. Mission in New York, where Glaspie was then assigned, by the end of that day.​
April has retired from the State Department.​
What to believe?
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

What to believe? Use common sense, what sounds right? What sounds believable?

Nobody has ever seen April Glaspie again, what does that tell you?

The subject matter is seldom spoke of, and never discussed in the main stream media, not then, not now, not ever, what does that tell you?
 
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Again, another senior moment. I mean exactly that. Its been four years since I've been there. The little thing about being on a peninsula always made me think it was Navy. No insult taken, I hope to compare the USAF to the swabbies.


The security forces guys do have boats and since MacDill is the home base for CENTCOM, SOCOM, JCSE, and my unit, there are an inordinate amount of squids running around on this Air Force Base.
 

The Seer

EOG Dedicated
Re: An Iraqi city councilman just shot and killed 3 of our brave soldiers!!

Squids? Now that is pollution!
 
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