My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

I will bump my favorite thread at EOG, without a doubt it was the most EDUCATED threads I've ever read at EOG.........
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

rainbow,

I agree with everything you shared. For me personally, this was the most informative and educational thread I have ever read during the three years that EOG has been around...

Some of our sharpest posters participated in it...

The General,

I recall this bookmaker telling both of us on the phone that IF they chose to, they could book bets at -$101 or -$102 juice and still make a profit...

The name of this book is PINNACLE...

And they were reacting to CRIS/BOOKMAKER'S sudden decision to stop doing transfers with them years ago...

Oh the times, they are changing...

THE SHRINK
I wish you were still with us....... this was favorite thread too...........
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

did don best ruin the "game" for everyone. before db, the ofices either had a wise guy
or two coming in with low limits to keep accurate or if they didn't have this
they would call another bookie who did, and lay off with him for this prilidge..
the point here, is that we never moved off a number no matter what, until
a wise guy bet a number. so we took money at every number and it was great
for everyone. now, i know dfor a fact, call centers who need to protect their
agent/owners' players absolutely move on air. don best became a fucking
bible for the stupid linesmen who don't get it. many many linesmen are latinos
who never learned the business the right way. and, they refuse to listen and
learn. even many agents don't want a virgin number. "we want a number on the screen
they cry." idiots, all idiots. if a game is 5 and goes to 6, most won't evem let
you go to 5.5 and at least get a 1/2 point edge on first hit. same in bases. a move
goes 6 cents, you say i'll move 3 cents to at least get a small edge and yet stillget a bet--
oh no, they cry--we want tomatch the screen. so man many call centers--and i'm not
speaking of ones with names we all know--absolutely are ordered to move on air--
and the linesmen love it because they are robots who cannot think things out.
another problen for call centers is that when they see their action, they are
looking at action for perhaps 60 clients from differentegions with 6000 or more
bettors from all over the country. some agent from boston would be pissed
if you halted a line on the pats, say, at 4, while everyone else went to 4.5.
waiting to get a hit. why would he care about moving on air or waiting to
get hit at 4.
so, it's a whole new arena out there. even the big books have credit agents
they must baby to, and moving like the above example would not be the
best for some of their clients either.
when you have more than just your own book, it's a different scenario.
with just your own book, with enough financial support, i personally
agree---take money at every number--on the way up and on the way down.
how else could you possible receive action on both sides--and i'm not taliking
of 5000/5000 which sucks for the bigger book whether it's individual or a
call center. always better to have 50,000/25,000 etc. but hard to get this
if you move on air. peace to all.
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

did don best ruin the "game" for everyone. before db, the ofices either had a wise guy
or two coming in with low limits to keep accurate or if they didn't have this
they would call another bookie who did, and lay off with him for this prilidge..
the point here, is that we never moved off a number no matter what, until
a wise guy bet a number. so we took money at every number and it was great
for everyone. now, i know dfor a fact, call centers who need to protect their
agent/owners' players absolutely move on air. don best became a fucking
bible for the stupid linesmen who don't get it. many many linesmen are latinos
who never learned the business the right way. and, they refuse to listen and
learn. even many agents don't want a virgin number. "we want a number on the screen
they cry." idiots, all idiots. if a game is 5 and goes to 6, most won't evem let
you go to 5.5 and at least get a 1/2 point edge on first hit. same in bases. a move
goes 6 cents, you say i'll move 3 cents to at least get a small edge and yet stillget a bet--
oh no, they cry--we want tomatch the screen. so man many call centers--and i'm not
speaking of ones with names we all know--absolutely are ordered to move on air--
and the linesmen love it because they are robots who cannot think things out.
another problen for call centers is that when they see their action, they are
looking at action for perhaps 60 clients from differentegions with 6000 or more
bettors from all over the country. some agent from boston would be pissed
if you halted a line on the pats, say, at 4, while everyone else went to 4.5.
waiting to get a hit. why would he care about moving on air or waiting to
get hit at 4.
so, it's a whole new arena out there. even the big books have credit agents
they must baby to, and moving like the above example would not be the
best for some of their clients either.
when you have more than just your own book, it's a different scenario.
with just your own book, with enough financial support, i personally
agree---take money at every number--on the way up and on the way down.
how else could you possible receive action on both sides--and i'm not taliking
of 5000/5000 which sucks for the bigger book whether it's individual or a
call center. always better to have 50,000/25,000 etc. but hard to get this
if you move on air. peace to all.
Excellent post, I just wish Donbest never existed...... thats why nothing will ever beat the Pioneer days......
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

I have to dissagree with you 100%, all the smart books I know will NEVER dry move and never move a line off of COLD money, you have to be real sharp, I cant explain to you in words, it would take me like 3 pages to write.
Every book on the screen moves on AIR, EVERYONE! If CRIS is sitting on Dallas -4 and for some reason (never happen but) if the steam comes on Dallas and everyone gets hit on Dallas and Dallas goes to 4.5, 5, 5.5 CRIS will not sit there waiting for a bet. From the few posts i've read I assume you work as a BM or on a stage at a shop. So you should know when the orders go out to bet Dallas -4 its not a coincidence that every book gets hit at the same time. Originators have people calling every book at the exact same time trying to get down as much as possible before the game gets held up, and followers come begging. A major book is not going to be 1.5 or 30 cents off the market because they didnt get bet. If that was the case Don Best wouldn't exsist because the majority of their clints are bookmakers not players.
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Every book on the screen moves on AIR, EVERYONE! If CRIS is sitting on Dallas -4 and for some reason (never happen but) if the steam comes on Dallas and everyone gets hit on Dallas and Dallas goes to 4.5, 5, 5.5 CRIS will not sit there waiting for a bet. From the few posts i've read I assume you work as a BM or on a stage at a shop. So you should know when the orders go out to bet Dallas -4 its not a coincidence that every book gets hit at the same time. Originators have people calling every book at the exact same time trying to get down as much as possible before the game gets held up, and followers come begging. A major book is not going to be 1.5 or 30 cents off the market because they didnt get bet. If that was the case Don Best wouldn't exsist because the majority of their clints are bookmakers not players.
I understand you completely, the books I've worked for always got bet on originators games, and I don't believe in dry moving, I can remember back in the ole days if we were taking 5 dimes in the college hoops and we got double hit my boss would give them 3 dimes a piece instead of swallowing the whole 10 dimes, and trust me he got on the phone and talked to the players on the phone and explained that he would entitle the wager but for 3 dimes only........
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Every book on the screen moves on AIR, EVERYONE! If CRIS is sitting on Dallas -4 and for some reason (never happen but) if the steam comes on Dallas and everyone gets hit on Dallas and Dallas goes to 4.5, 5, 5.5 CRIS will not sit there waiting for a bet. From the few posts i've read I assume you work as a BM or on a stage at a shop. So you should know when the orders go out to bet Dallas -4 its not a coincidence that every book gets hit at the same time. Originators have people calling every book at the exact same time trying to get down as much as possible before the game gets held up, and followers come begging. A major book is not going to be 1.5 or 30 cents off the market because they didnt get bet. If that was the case Don Best wouldn't exsist because the majority of their clints are bookmakers not players.
Tyrone...don't know where you get your info, but let me tell you something I do know...CRIS gets hit maybe not first, but within seconds after the play is released...they have never moved any of the major sports without getting hit...I worked there for a number of years...the people who run things there would rather take a bet than discourage one, because they know somebody will buy back....they do not move on air...

That being said, welcome to EOG and hope to see you around in the future....
 

IrishTim

EOG Dedicated
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Tyrone...don't know where you get your info, but let me tell you something I do know...CRIS gets hit maybe not first, but within seconds after the play is released...they have never moved any of the major sports without getting hit...I worked there for a number of years...the people who run things there would rather take a bet than discourage one, because they know somebody will buy back....they do not move on air...
On an old WW episode I recall either the Legendz guy or BetPhoenix guy saying how they never moved on air. When I heard it, I thought to myself what a bunch of bullshit - they're little cell goes black as soon as Pinnacle and CRIS's does. But I the more I thought about it, the more I came to think that it probably just seemed like they were moving on air because they were adjusting their lines at the same time as the rest of the market but in reality they were probably getting hit almost simultaneously as the other books were. I'm still skeptical (that they never move on air), but my faith has been restored a bit.

A question though, why would CRIS/Olympic/Phoenix limit a player who is chasing steam then if they are going to wait for the money to come in anyway before moving? The way I see it, you can't have it both ways. You're either (a) moving on air when Pinny goes because you don't want to get hit at the previous number or (b) you refuse to move on air and are going to wait to get bet before you move so who cares if it's some screen watcher betting 5 seconds after Pinnacle moves. Not sure if that makes sense, been up for about 36 hours now studying, but just a thought.
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Hello Eog-
Its been awhile. I loved this thread too. Just wanted to state that CRIS does not move on air. Period. They are the cream of the crop, period. Pinny, OLY, CRIS, and Grande. Thats it, thats all its ever been. The best of the best.

Ironlock
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

That was Steak Tartar from Legendz...and he was right...all the major books get hit at the same time...

Billy W. had a habit of getting a little angry if somebody beat his move on a game..99% of the time it was a greedy mover of his...sometimes a couple players call in on the same game at the same time..instead of giving one of the players a full bet, the lines manager gives each of them 5K on a limit 10K bet just to keep them happy...

Another thing to know is that all the books don't use the same books on their DB screens or whatever screen they use...Pinny or Olympic moves wouldn't show if they are not on the screen...

CRIS never moved on air when I was there...there was always somebody buying back at the new price...
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Hello Eog-
Its been awhile. I loved this thread too. Just wanted to state that CRIS does not move on air. Period. They are the cream of the crop, period. Pinny, OLY, CRIS, and Grande. Thats it, thats all its ever been. The best of the best.

Ironlock
Hello Ironlock....good to see you around again....
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Steam chasers never got the original number and begged during the session for the previous number...they always thought they were first...

The books used to cater to Billy W., nowadays not so much...

Every now and then a steam chaser would call at the same time as Billy, or maybe a microsecond before...that's why the confusion, especially when all the wise guy phones would light up at the same time...
 

jam

EOG Veteran
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Nice bump. Almost spit out my beer laughing at Ironlock taking another poster to the woodshed.

It was to read stuff like this that I joined this forum. Good stuff recently about The M and Cantor Gaming as well.

Gonna check out Winning Wednesdays for the first time as I'm intrigued by the guest.
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

On an old WW episode I recall either the Legendz guy or BetPhoenix guy saying how they never moved on air. When I heard it, I thought to myself what a bunch of bullshit - they're little cell goes black as soon as Pinnacle and CRIS's does. But I the more I thought about it, the more I came to think that it probably just seemed like they were moving on air because they were adjusting their lines at the same time as the rest of the market but in reality they were probably getting hit almost simultaneously as the other books were. I'm still skeptical (that they never move on air), but my faith has been restored a bit.

A question though, why would CRIS/Olympic/Phoenix limit a player who is chasing steam then if they are going to wait for the money to come in anyway before moving? The way I see it, you can't have it both ways. You're either (a) moving on air when Pinny goes because you don't want to get hit at the previous number or (b) you refuse to move on air and are going to wait to get bet before you move so who cares if it's some screen watcher betting 5 seconds after Pinnacle moves. Not sure if that makes sense, been up for about 36 hours now studying, but just a thought.
I get hit first alot of times and than I ADJUST the ML, 1st quarter, and the 1st half too... first quarter,first half and ML adjustments are routine for me
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

For the sake of argument, first quarter, first half, and ML are seperate entities...no need to move them on a straight bet on the team involved....but I know a lot of line movers that do....

Sometimes the money line can be manipulated to help the book's exposure on a game....
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

For the sake of argument, first quarter, first half, and ML are seperate entities...no need to move them on a straight bet on the team involved....but I know a lot of line movers that do....

Sometimes the money line can be manipulated to help the book's exposure on a game....
If Bw lays -6 on a game and I go to -7 and if you don't move the rest I feel sorry for you, because its the right thing to do period, everybody knows that. example: if BW lays you -6 on a game why would you want someone to lay you a stale -260 ML?
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

For the sake of argument, first quarter, first half, and ML are seperate entities...no need to move them on a straight bet on the team involved....but I know a lot of line movers that do....

Sometimes the money line can be manipulated to help the book's exposure on a game....
And its routine for me to go from 3.5 to 4 on the 1st half spread after he lays the -6 I'm different from alot of linesmovers, thats just the way I do things.....
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

For the sake of argument, first quarter, first half, and ML are seperate entities...no need to move them on a straight bet on the team involved....but I know a lot of line movers that do....

Sometimes the money line can be manipulated to help the book's exposure on a game....
The moneyline can be manipulated only if they bet the dog in the game, and I still move the line on that too......
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

If he bets me a College basketball game -6 I'm going straight to -7 and moving the ML from -260 to -300, and if he bets me -6 on a College football game I'm going from -6 to -6.5 and moving the ML from -260 to -280 or from -280 to -300 thats just the way I move lines, I've been doing that a very longtime, I don't see myself changing my strategy anytime soon on that......
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Curious Rain are you talking OFFSHORE SCREEN STRATEGY ? Are these post up stores? The multiple products being discussed would lend themselves to post up stores > I dont think a credit storecould make it offering these products
 

$tinky

EOG Senior Member
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

I get hit first alot of times and than I ADJUST the ML, 1st quarter, and the 1st half too... first quarter,first half and ML adjustments are routine for me

Why is that not the same thing as an "air move" or to use your terminology "dry move". Do you not agree that the game 1h, 1q and ml are all seperate contests? I'm not saying that I don't agree that its good to go adjust those when u get hit. You just seem so dead set on not dry moving.
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Curious Rain are you talking OFFSHORE SCREEN STRATEGY ? Are these post up stores? The multiple products being discussed would lend themselves to post up stores > I dont think a credit storecould make it offering these products
It doesn't matter if its credit ot post-up...... you can't leave up stale ML 's, 1st halfs, or quarter lines when the syndicate makes a play with you or an originator.....
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Why is that not the same thing as an "air move" or to use your terminology "dry move". Do you not agree that the game 1h, 1q and ml are all seperate contests? I'm not saying that I don't agree that its good to go adjust those when u get hit. You just seem so dead set on not dry moving.
I'm not scared to take a bet from anybody in the world period, but AFTER I get bet I move the rest, its routine for me, like I said I do things alot different than some bookies.....
 

$tinky

EOG Senior Member
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

On an old WW episode I recall either the Legendz guy or BetPhoenix guy saying how they never moved on air. When I heard it, I thought to myself what a bunch of bullshit - they're little cell goes black as soon as Pinnacle and CRIS's does. But I the more I thought about it, the more I came to think that it probably just seemed like they were moving on air because they were adjusting their lines at the same time as the rest of the market but in reality they were probably getting hit almost simultaneously as the other books were. I'm still skeptical (that they never move on air), but my faith has been restored a bit.

A question though, why would CRIS/Olympic/Phoenix limit a player who is chasing steam then if they are going to wait for the money to come in anyway before moving? The way I see it, you can't have it both ways. You're either (a) moving on air when Pinny goes because you don't want to get hit at the previous number or (b) you refuse to move on air and are going to wait to get bet before you move so who cares if it's some screen watcher betting 5 seconds after Pinnacle moves. Not sure if that makes sense, been up for about 36 hours now studying, but just a thought.
I totally agree with what you are saying. I used to think like tyrone. I thought that every spot just moved because the others were. You catch oly with a stale line, its not because they are asleep at the wheel, they just haven't got bet yet. Carib is another example of a book that doesn't move on air.

Don't get me wrong I think more move on air than don't. Especially head shops, offscreen shops etc. Their line movers are taught to make their lines look like cris. Thats their training manual.
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Just saying if a syndicate plays you and you move all those lines, what happens if BW comes back and bets the other way...
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

I totally agree with what you are saying. I used to think like tyrone. I thought that every spot just moved because the others were. You catch oly with a stale line, its not because they are asleep at the wheel, they just haven't got bet yet. Carib is another example of a book that doesn't move on air.

Don't get me wrong I think more move on air than don't. Especially head shops, offscreen shops etc. Their line movers are taught to make their lines look like cris. Thats their training manual.
Good points
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

Why is that not the same thing as an "air move" or to use your terminology "dry move". Do you not agree that the game 1h, 1q and ml are all seperate contests? I'm not saying that I don't agree that its good to go adjust those when u get hit. You just seem so dead set on not dry moving.
And if someone smart bets me on the dog in baseball I move the runline too...
 
Re: My Knowledge Of A Bookie To Be Successful.

If Bw lays -6 on a game and I go to -7 and if you don't move the rest I feel sorry for you, because its the right thing to do period, everybody knows that. example: if BW lays you -6 on a game why would you want someone to lay you a stale -260 ML?
Because somebody smart will take the plus 7....
 
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