Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Studies show that sodomites abuse drugs and alcohol in overwhelming numbers.

Judging by "Manny's" sick cyber-man crush on me the last few years; AND his well documented addictions to...well...everything; AND his openly perverted sexual proclivities; AND his militant sodomite agenda activism, including his support for NAMBLA...I think it's a safe bet that he's a closet f-a-g.

THAT'S RIGHT, I SAID IT!

MANNY IS A CLOSET F-A-G!!


Explains a lot, don't it?

Is that why your body has more toxins in it than Michael Jackson's rotting corpse, "Manny"?

Is that why you write bad checks and mow lawns and peddle Amway to pay for your addictions, "Manny"?

Is that why you talk to dead people, "Manny"? To make sense of all those demons who have haunted you since childhood?
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

<center> [FONT=verdana,arial]What Has Been Concluded From
1000 Recent Articles On Homosexuality?


[/FONT]</center>
By James Phelan, Ph.D.​
The following is reprinted by permission from "Cultural War" blog by James Phelan, Ph.D.
December 29, 2007 - John R. Hughes, of the University of Illinois Medical Center reviewed the most recent 1000 Medline searched articles on male homosexuality and lesbianism, up until the time of publication of his article in the 2006 Winter issue of Sexuality and Disability

http://www.springer.com/west/home/psychology?SGWID=4-10126-70-35748469-0.

Etiology


After reviewing the studies on biology and social factors, Hughes concluded:

Thus, some individuals develop homosexuality presumably from earlier sexual abuse. As in nearly all diseases/disorders, both physical (genetic) and psychological (environmental) factors may play a role in varying amounts in particular individuals. One gay male may have definite feminine characteristics that would play a role in his sexual orientation, while another gay male with prominent masculine secondary sex characteristics may have in his history environmental factors to account for his homosexuality. (p. 197)

Prevalence

After looking at the recent reports which indicated sexual orientation prevalence, Hughes stated: "In summary, the prevalence of homosexuality is 3-5%, likely 2-4% for lesbians, and 3% for bisexuality, although exceptions can be found in particular groups or countries" (p. 197).

Related Diseases

HIV

Hughes found that the cases of HIV+ in the 1980s that were homosexual were usually around 75%. As of 2005, he noted that "the value in number of HIV+ patients who were gay were reported as 61% although the prevalence depend[ed] on the country involved with the sampling" (p. 198).

Syphilis and other venereal diseases

Hughes found that for gay men, beyond HIV, syphilis, genito-urinary infections and anal carcinomas were significant. Bacterial vaginosis, cerebral vascular disease, polycystic ovaries, and androgehypernism were higher in lesbians than heterosexual women.

Characteristics as a subgroup

Drugs and alcohol


As a subgroup, 50% of gays admit to illicit drug use. Lesbians spent more time in bars and drank more alcohol than heterosexual females.

Unprotected anal sex

The hallmark finding was that 50-60% of male homosexuals have engaged in unprotected anal sex and 21% report never using a condom.

Casual partners

Consistency in studies show casual partnering increasing, not decreasing (which might be expected considering there is an increase in society acceptance of homosexuals), as evidenced in reports about weekend resorts, public sex environments, bath houses, e-dating, and circuit parties.

Other characteristics

Suicidation, molestation, and violence were other factors found to be disproportionately higher in the homosexual subgroup.

Fluidity or "Change in sexual orientation over time"

Hughes noted, which I found particularly interesting, that pediatric reports indicated that there appears to be some degree of conditioning and choice in sexual orientation, that it is not necessarily a fixed state. Hughes found that in some instances males appeared to have been homosexual from early childhood onward and in most instances, changes likely would not occur.

However, in other cases there appeared to have been some degree of conditioning and choice in sexual orientation. This type of change over time had been carefully studied in 762 self-identified heterosexual, bisexual and gay men and women.

Scores were derived in three dimensions (fantasy, romantic attraction and actual sexual behavior). Cumulative scores were determined over consecutive 5-year time periods. There were significant sex differences in reported changes in orientation over time for both gays and heterosexuals, with women reporting greater changes in orientation over time than did men. Specifically, lesbians were far more likely than gay men to report having previously identified themselves as something other than homosexual (65% of lesbians, 39% of gay men). A one-point shift on any dimension over their lives was reported in 48% of gay men and 20% of lesbian women.

"Thus," he concluded, "it is a myth, according to these data, that once one discovers that they are gay, they always have been and will be gay."

Hughes did spend some time discussing a controversial study, titled, "Homosexual sex as harmful as drug abuse, prostitution or smoking" by Dr Paul Cameron, which has been criticized by pro-gay groups. The work of Cameron is largely dismissed.

Hughes mentioned in his conclusion that he anticipated opposition to his report, which I agree is understandable given the political environment we live in. He said his findings were objective and that he hoped readers would not "shoot the messenger." Obviously, he is aware of the defensiveness of gay activists!

Reference:
Hughes, John R. (2006). A general review of recent reports on homosexuality and lesbianism. Sexuality and Disability, 24, 195-205.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

By the way, to the posting friend who sent me a PM and predicted "Joe will be pulling out the Giant Multi-Colored Font this evening", I give you a hat tip and owe you $5 for your correct forecast of Mark's now rather predicable bi-polar posting style.

It's not that hard a rhythm to detect after you've seen him do it a few times in a row, in a row, in a row

row row row

ho ho ho
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

What is an F-A-G?

Is that a clever acronym that you learned during your years of "writing copy"? heh

Is an F-A-G better or worse than being a P-A-W (Pretend American Wimp)?


Why do you take psychedelic drugs, "Manny"?

Why do you talk to dead people, "Manny"?

Why do you write bad checks, mow lawns and peddle Amway junk to pay for your psychedelic drugs, "Manny"?

Why are you member of multiple cults, "Manny"?

Why do you have a cyber mancrush on me, "Manny"?

<table width="970" bgcolor="#a7b9c5" border="0" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr><td rowspan="1" valign="top" width="665" bgcolor="#ffffff"><table width="100%" bgcolor="#a7b9c5" border="0" cellpadding="20" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" align="left" bgcolor="#ffffff">Homosexuality and Mental Health Problems

By N.E. Whitehead, Ph.D.
(Author of "My Genes Made Me Do It")
Summary: Recent studies show homosexuals have a substantially greater risk of suffering from a psychiatric problems than do heterosexuals. We see higher rates of suicide, depression, bulimia, antisocial personality disorder, and substance abuse. This paper highlights some new and significant considerations that reflect on the question of those mental illnesses and on their possible sources.

The American Psychiatric Association removed homosexuality from its diagnostic list of mental disorders in 1973, despite substantial protest (see Socarides, 1995). The A.P.A. was strongly motivated by the desire to reduce the effects of social oppression. However, one effect of the A.P.A.'s action was to add psychiatric authority to gay activists' insistence that homosexuals as a group are as healthy as heterosexuals. This has discouraged publication of research that suggests there may, in fact, be psychiatric problems associated with homosexuality.

In a review of the literature, Gonsiorek (1982) argued there was no data showing mental differences between gays and straights--or if there was any, it could be attributed to social stigma. Similarly, Ross (1988) in a cross-cultural study, found most gays were in the normal psychological range. However some papers did give hints of psychiatric differences between homosexuals and heterosexuals. One study (Riess, 1980) used the MMPI, that venerable and well-validated psychological scale, and found that homosexuals showed definite "personal and emotional oversensitivity."

In 1991 the absolute equality of homosexuality and heterosexuality was strongly defended in a paper called "The Empirical Basis for the Demise of the Mental Illness Model" (Gonsiorek, 1991). But not until 1992 was homosexuality dropped from the psychiatric manual used by other nations--the International Classification of Diseases (King and Bartlett, 1999)--so it appears the rest of the world doubted the APA 1973 decision for nearly two decades.

Is homosexuality as healthy as heterosexuality? To answer that question, what is needed are representative samples of homosexual people which study their mental health, unlike the volunteer samples which have, in the past, selected out any disturbed or gender-atypical subjects (such as in the well-known study by Evelyn Hooker). And fortunately, such representative surveys have lately become available.

New Studies Suggest Higher Level of Pathology

One important and carefully conducted study found suicide attempts among homosexuals were six times greater than the average (Remafedi et al. 1998).

Then, more recently, in the Archives of General Psychiatry-- an established and well-respected journal--three papers appeared with extensive accompanying commentary (Fergusson et al. 1999, Herrell et al. 1999, Sandfort et al. 2001, and e.g. Bailey 1999). J. Michael Bailey included a commentary on the above research; Bailey, it should be noted, conducted many of the muchpublicized "gay twin studies" which were used by gay advocates as support for the "born that way" theory. Neil Whitehead, Ph.D.

Bailey said, "These studies contain arguably the best published data on the association between homosexuality and psychopathology, and both converge on the same unhappy conclusion: homosexual people are at substantially higher risk for some forms of emotional problems, including suicidality, major depression, and anxiety disorder, conduct disorder, and nicotine dependence...The strength of the new studies is their degree of control."

The first study was on male twins who had served in Vietnam (Herrell et al. 1999). It concluded that on average, male homosexuals were 5.1 times more likely to exhibit suicide- related behavior or thoughts than their heterosexual counterparts. Some of this factor of 5.1 was associated with depression and substance abuse, which might or might not be related to the homosexuality. (When these two problems were factored out, the factor of 5 decreased to 2.5; still somewhat significant.) The authors believed there was an independent factor related to suicidality which was probably closely associated with some features of homosexuality itself.

The second study (Fergusson et al. 1999) followed a large New Zealand group from birth to their early twenties. The "birth cohort" method of subject selection is especially reliable and free from most of the biases which bedevil surveys. This study showed a significantly higher occurrence of depression, anxiety disorder, conduct disorder, substance abuse and thoughts about suicide, amongst those who were homosexually active.

The third paper was a Netherlands study (Sandfort et al. 2001) which again showed a higher level of mental-health problems among homosexuals, but remarkably, subjects with HIV infection was not any more likely than those without HIV infection to suffer from mental health problems. People who are HIV-positive should at least be expected to be anxious or depressed!

The paper thus concluded that HIV infection is not a cause of mental health problems--but that stigmatization from society was likely the cause--even in the Netherlands, where alternative lifestyles are more widely accepted than in most other countries. That interpretation of the data is quite unconvincing.

The commentaries on those studies brought up three interesting issues.

1. First, there is now clear evidence that mental health problems are indeed associated with homosexuality. This supports those who opposed the APA actions in 1973. However, the present papers do not answer the question; is homosexuality itself pathological?

2. The papers do show that since only a minority of a nonclinical sample of homosexuals has any diagnosable mental problems (at least by present diagnostic criteria), then most homosexuals are not mentally ill.
In New Zealand, for example, lesbians are about twice as likely to have sought help for mental problems as heterosexual women, but only about 35% of them over their lifespan did so, and never more than 50% (Anon 1995, Saphira and Glover, 2000, Welch et al. 2000) This corresponds with similar findings from the U.S.

Relationship Breakups Motivate Most
Suicide Attempts


Next, we ask--do the papers show that it is gay lifestyle factors, or society's stigmatization, that are the motivators that lead a person to attempt suicide? Neither conclusion is inevitable. Still, Saghir and Robins (1978) examined reasons for suicide attempts among homosexuals and found that if the reasons for the attempt were connected with homosexuality, about 2/3 were due to breakups of relationships --not outside pressures from society.

Similarly, Bell and Weinberg (1981) also found the major reason for suicide attempts was the breakup of relationships. In second place, they said, was the inability to accept oneself. Since homosexuals have greater numbers of partners and breakups, compared with heterosexuals, and since longterm gay male relationships are rarely monagamous, it is hardly surprising if suicide attempts are proportionally greater. The median number of partners for homosexuals is four times higher than for heterosexuals (Whitehead and Whitehead 1999, calculated from Laumann et al 1994).

A good general rule of thumb is that suicide attempts are about three times higher for homosexuals. Could there be a connection between those two percentages?

Another factor in suicide attempts would be the compulsive or addictive elements in homosexuality (Pincu, 1989 ) which could lead to feelings of depression when the lifestyle is out of control (Seligman 1975). There are some, (estimates vary, but perhaps as many as 50% of young men today), who do not take consistent precautions against HIV (Valleroy et al., 2001) and who have considerable problems with sexual addiction and substance abuse addiction, and this of course would feed into suicide attempts.

The Effect of Social Stigma

Third, does pressure from society lead to mental health problems? Less, I believe, than one might imagine. The authors of the study done in The Netherlands were surprised to find so much mental illness in homosexual people in a country where tolerance of homosexuality is greater than in almost all other countries.

Another good comparison country is New Zealand, which is much more tolerant of homosexuality than is the United States. Legislation giving the movement special legal rights is powerful, consistently enforced throughout the country, and virtually never challenged. Despite this broad level of social tolerance, suicide attempts were common in a New Zealand study and occurred at about the same rate as in the U.S.
In his cross-cultural comparison of mental health in the Netherlands, Denmark and the U.S., Ross (1988) could find no significant differences between countries - i.e. the greater social hostility in the United States did not result in a higher level of psychiatric problems.

There are three other issues not covered in the Archives journal articles which are worthy of consideration. The first two involve DSM category diagnoses.

Promiscuity and Antisocial Personality

The promiscuous person--either heterosexual or homosexual --may in fact be more likely to be antisocial. It is worth noting here the comment of Rotello (1997), who is himself openly gay: "...the outlaw aspect of gay sexual culture, its transgressiveness, is seen by many men as one of its greatest attributes."

Ellis et al. (1995) examined patients at an clinic which focused on genital and urological problems such as STD's; he found 38% of the homosexual men seeking such services had antisocial personality disorder, as well as 28% of heterosexual men. Both levels were enormously higher than the 2% rate of antisocial personality disorder for the general population (which in turn, compares to the 50% rate for prison inmates) (Matthews 1997).

Perhaps the finding of a higher level of conduct disorder in the New Zealand study foreshadowed this finding of antisocial personality . Therapists, of course, are not very likely to see a large number of individuals who are antisocial because they are probably less likely to seek help.

Secondly, it was previously noted that 43% of a bulimic sample of men were homosexual or bisexual (Carlat et al. 1997), a rate about 15 times higher than the rate in the population in general--meaning homosexual men are probably disproportionately liable to this mental condition. This may be due to the very strong preoccupation with appearance and physique frequently found among male homosexuals.

Ideology of Sexual Liberation

A strong case can be made that the male homosexual lifestyle itself, in its most extreme form, is mentally disturbed. Remember that Rotello, a gay advocate, notes that "the outlaw aspect of gay sexual culture, its transgressiveness, is seen by many men as one of its greatest attributes." Same-sex eroticism becomes for many, therefore, the central value of existence, and nothing else--not even life and health itself--is allowed to interfere with pursuit of this lifestyle. Homosexual promiscuity fuels the AIDS crisis in the West, but even that tragedy it is not allowed to interfere with sexual freedom.

And, according to Rotello, the idea of taking responsibility to avoid infecting others with the HIV virus is completely foreign to many groups trying to counter AIDS. The idea of protecting oneself is promoted, but protecting others is not mentioned in most official condom promotions (France in the '80s was an interesting exception). Bluntly, then, core gay behavior is both potentially fatal to others, and often suicidal.
Surely it should be considered "mentally disturbed" to risk losing one's life for sexual liberation. This is surely among the most extreme risks practiced by any significant fraction of society. I have not found a higher risk of death accepted by any similar-sized population.

In conclusion, then, if we ask the question "Is mental illness inherent in the homosexual condition?" the answer would have to be "Further research--uncompromised by politics --should be carried out to honestly evaluate this issue."

References
[FONT=verdana,arial] Anon. (1995): Lesbians use more mental health care. The Dominion (NZ) Nov 1, 14.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Bailey, J.M. (1999): Commentary: Homosexuality and mental illness. Arch. Gen. Psychiatry. 56, 876-880.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Bell, A.P.; Weinberg, M.S. (1978): Homosexualities. A Study Of Diversity Among Men And Women. Simon and Schuster, New York.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Carlat, D.J.; Camargo, C.A.; Herzog, D.B. (1997): Eating disorders in males: a report on 135 patients. Am. J. Psychiatry 154, 1127-1132.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Ellis, D; Collis, I; King, M (1995): Personality disorder and sexual risk taking among homosexually active and heterosexually active men attending a genito-urinary medicine clinic. J. Psychosom. Res. 39, 901-910.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Fergusson, D.M.; Horwood, L.J.; Beautrais, A.L. (1999): Is sexual orientation related to mental health problems and suicidality in young people? Arch. Gen. Psychiat. 56, 876- 880.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Gonsiorek, J.C. (1982): Results of psychological testing on homosexual populations. In: Homosexuality. Social, Psychological and Biological Issues. (Eds: Paul, W.; Weinrich, J.D.; Gonsiorek, J.C.; Hotvedt, M.E.) Sage, Beverly Hills, California, 71-80.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Gonsiorek, J.C. (1991): The empirical basis for the demise of the illness model of homosexuality. In: Homosexuality: Research Implications for Public Policy. (Eds: Gonsiorek,J.; Weinrich, J.D.) Sage, 115-136.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Herrell, R.; Goldberg, J.; True,W.R.; Ramakrishnan, V.; Lyons, M.; Eisen,S.; Tsuang, M.T. (1999): Sexual orientation and suicidality: a co-twin control study in adult men. Arch. Gen. Psychiatry 56, 867-874.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Kalichman, S.C.; Dwyer, M.; Henderson, M.C.; Hoffman, L. (1992): Psychological and sexual functioning among outpatient sexual offenders against children: A Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory (MMPI) cluster analytic study. J. Psychopath. Behav. Assess. 14, 259-276.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]King, M.; Bartlett, A. (1999): British psychiatry and homosexuality. Brit. J. Psychiatry. 175, 106-113.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Laumann, E.O.; Gagnon, J.H.; Michael, R.T.; Michaels, S. (1994). The Social Organization of Sexuality. University of Chicago Press, Chicago.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Matthews, R. (1997): Game theory backs crackdown on petty crime. New Scientist 156(2078), 18.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Pincu, L. (1989): Sexual compulsivity in gay men: controversy and treatment. J. Couns. Dev. 68(1), 63-66.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Remafedi, G.; French, S.; Story, M.; Resnick, M.D.; Blum, R. (1998): The relationship between suicide risk and sexual orientation: Results of a population-based study. Am. J. Publ. Health 88, 57-60.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Riess, B. (1980): Psychological tests in homosexuality. In: Homosexual Behavior: A Modern Appraisal. (Ed: Macmor,J.) Basic Books, New York, 298-311.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Ross, M.W. (1988): Homosexuality and mental health: a cross-cultural review. J. Homosex. 15(1/2), 131-152.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Rotello, G. (1997): Sexual Ecology. AIDS and the Destiny of Gay Men. Dutton, Harmondsworth, Middlesex, UK.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Saghir, M.T.; Robins, E. (1973): Male and Female Homosexuality, A Comprehensive Investigation. Williams and Wilkins, Baltimore Maryland. 335 pages.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Sandfort, T.G.M.; de Graaf, R.; Bijl, R.V.; Schnabel (2001): Same-sex sexual behavior and psychiatric disorders. Arch. Gen. Psychiatry. 58, 85-91.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Saphira, M.; Glover, M. (2000): New Zealand lesbian health survey. J. Gay Lesb. Med. Assn. 4, 49-56.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Seligman, M.E.P. (1975): Helplessness - On Depression, Development And Death. Freeman, London.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Socarides, C.W. (1995): Homosexuality: A Freedom Too Far. Adam Margrave Books, Phoenix, Arizona.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Valleroy, L. A.; Secura, G.; Mackellor, D.; Behel,S. (2001): High HIV and risk behavior prevalence among 23- to 29- year-old men who have sex with men in 6 U.S. Cities. Poster 211 at 8th Conference on Retroviruses and Opportunistic[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Infections, Chicago, Feb. 2001. http://64.58.70.224/2001/posters/211.pdf.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Welch, S.; Collings,S.C.D.; Howden-Chapman,P. (2000): Lesbians in New Zealand: Their mental health and satisfaction with mental health services. Aust. N.Z.J. Psychiatry 34, 256-263.[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial]Whitehead, N.E.; Whitehead, B.K. (1999): My Genes Made Me Do It! Huntington House, Lafayette, Louisiana.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana,Arial]Updated: 3 September 2008[/FONT]
</td> </tr> </tbody></table> <!-- CONTENT TABLE --> </td> <!-- ROW ONE CONTENT CELL --> <!-- ROW ONE RIGHT CELL --> <!-- ROW ONE RIGHT CELL --> </tr> </tbody></table>
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

What is an F-A-G, Mark?

Are you trying to be a cyber-tease again??

quit flirting and tell us how you really feel
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

What is an F-A-G, Mark?

Are you trying to be a cyber-tease again??

quit flirting and tell us how you really feel
Why do you take psychedelic drugs, Steve?

Why do you write bad checks, mow lawns and peddle Amway junk to pay for those psychedelic drugs, Steve?

Why do you talk to dead people, Steve?

Why are you a member of multiple cults, Steve?

Why are you a militant sodomite activist, Steve?

Why do you have a cyber mancrush on me, Steve?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gay Teens: Studies On
Emotional/Relational Health


by Dr. Richard Fitzgibbons​
October 17, 2005 - Recent claims by Time magazine gay journalist John Cloud about positive mental health among gay teens is contradicted by studies on emotional and relational instability among gays in several studies.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Suicide in America, 1995
Herbert Hendin, M.D.
Executive Director American Suicide Foundation
New York, Professor of Psychiatry
New York Medical College

"The extreme vulnerability to rejection of suicidal homosexuals may have an important social component as well. With all its sexual and social activity, the "gay life" provides no more than an alienated and isolated existence for many homosexuals. Continuity of relationships between two homosexuals is rare, although many homosexuals spend a lifetime seeking it. For those who do seek it, any relationship that offers that possibility is apt to be intensely over invested rather quickly. Since such relationships usually lack social or family support, rejection or disappointment signifies not merely abandonment but despair over the inability to escape emotional isolation." Page 146

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Sexual Organization of the City Laumann, E, et al., U. of Chicago, 2004.

In this major study of homosexual dating patterns, Laumann discovered that most of those with same sex attractions spend their lives in "transactional" relationships (short term commitments that last than six months on average).

Professor Laumann's research provides additional evidence that males with SSA, in particular, experience pervasive loneliness and many short-lived relationships.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> AIDS 17,7:1029-1038, 2003. Dr. Maria Xiridou with the Amsterdam Municipal Health Service found that consensual infidelity was the norm. The average relationship lasted 1.5 years. Those in casual relationships averaged between 16 -28 sexual partners per year. Also, 86% of the new HIV infections in Amsterdam occurred among those in steady relationships.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Lifetime prevalence of DSM- III- R Psychiatric Disorders
<table border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr> <td></td> <td>Homosexual (SSA) </td> <td>Heterosexual</td> </tr> <tr> <td>Mood disorders</td> <td>39.0%</td> <td>13.3%</td> </tr> <tr> <td>Major depression</td> <td>39.3%</td> <td>10.9%</td> </tr> <tr> <td>Anxiety disorders</td> <td>31.7%</td> <td>13.2%</td> </tr> <tr> <td>One or more diagnoses </td> <td>56.1%</td> <td>41.4%</td> </tr> <tr> <td>Two or more</td> <td>37.8%</td> <td>14.4%</td> </tr> </tbody></table>
Stanford et al. (2001) Arch Gen Psychiatry, Vol. 58.

Study from the Netherlands of 5, 898 adults of which 2.1% self-identified as homosexual.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Arch Gen Psychiatry 1999 Oct; 56(10):876-80
Is sexual orientation related to mental health problems and suicidality in young people?

Fergusson DM, Horwood LJ, Beautrais AL. Christchurch Health and Development Study, Christchurch School of Medicine, New Zealand.
BACKGROUND: This study examines the extent to which gay, lesbian, and bisexual young people are at increased risk of psychiatric disorder and suicidal behaviors using data gathered on a New Zealand birth cohort studied to age 21 years.

METHODS: Data were gathered during the course of the Christchurch Health and Development Study, a 21-year longitudinal study of a birth cohort of 1265 children born in Christchurch, New Zealand. At 21 years of age, 1007 sample members were questioned about their sexual orientation and relationships with same-sex partners since the age of 16 years.

Twenty-eight subjects (2.8%) were classified as being of gay, lesbian, or bisexual sexual orientation. Over the period from age 14 to 21 years, data were gathered on a range of psychiatric disorders that included major depression, generalized anxiety disorder, conduct disorder, and substance use disorders. Data were also gathered on suicidal ideation and suicide attempts.

RESULTS: Gay, lesbian, and bisexual young people were at increased risks of major depression (odds ratio [OR], 4.0; 95% confidence interval [CI], 1.8-9.3), generalized anxiety disorder (OR, 2.8; 95% CI, 1.2-6.5), conduct disorder (OR, 3.8; 95% CI, 1.7-8.7), nicotine dependence (OR, 5.0; 95%, CI, 2.3-10.9), other substance abuse and/or dependence (OR, 1.9; 95% CI, 0.9-4.2), multiple disorders (OR, 5.9; 95% CI, 2.4-14.8), suicidal ideation (OR, 5.4; 95% CI, 2.4-12.2), and suicide attempts (OR, 6.2; 95% CI, 2.7-14.3).

CONCLUSIONS: Findings support recent evidence suggesting that gay, lesbian, and bisexual young people are at increased risk of mental health problems, with these associations being particularly evident for measures of suicidal behavior and multiple disorder.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Sexual Orientation and Suicidality -- A Co-twin Control Study in Adult Men

Richard Herrell, MS; Jack Goldberg, PhD; William R. True, PhD, MPH; Visvanathan Ramakrishnan, PhD; Michael Lyons, PhD; Seth Eisen, MD; Ming T. Tsuang, MD, DSc, PhD, Arch Gen Psychiatry. 1999; 56:867-874.

BACKGROUND: Several recent studies have found a higher lifetime prevalence of suicide attempts in homosexual males compared with heterosexual control subjects or population rates. These studies used either convenience samples, most without controls, or population-based samples in which confounding factors such as depression and substance abuse were not measured.

METHODS: This study used twins from the population-based Vietnam Era Twin Registry, Hines, Ill. An analytic sample of 103 middle-aged male-male twin pairs from the registry was identified in which one member of the pair reported male sex partners after age 18 years while the other did not. Four lifetime symptoms of suicidality as measured by the Diagnostic Interview Schedule were analyzed: thoughts about death, wanting to die, thoughts about committing suicide, and attempted suicide. A composite measure of reporting at least one suicidality symptom was also assessed.

RESULTS: Same-gender sexual orientation is significantly associated with each of the suicidality measures. Unadjusted matched-pair odds ratios follow: 2.4 (95% confidence interval [CI], 1.2-4.6) for thoughts about death; 4.4 (95% CI, 1.7-11.6) for wanted to die; 4.1 (95% CI, 2.1-8.2) for suicidal ideation; 6.5 (95% CI, 1.5-28.8) for attempted suicide; and 5.1 (95% CI, 2.4-10.9) for any of the suicidal symptoms. After adjustment for substance abuse and depressive symptoms (other than suicidality), all of the suicidality measures remain significantly associated with same-gender sexual orientation except for wanting to die (odds ratio, 2.5 [95% CI, 0.7-8.8]).

CONCLUSIONS: The substantially increased lifetime risk of suicidal behaviors in homosexual men is unlikely to be due solely to substance abuse or other psychiatric comorbidity. While the underlying causes of the suicidal behaviors remain unclear, future research needs to address the inadequacies in the measurement of both sexual orientation and suicidality in population-based samples.

From the Division of Epidemiology-Biostatistics, School of Public Health, University of Illinois at Chicago (Mr Herrell and Drs Goldberg and Ramakrishnan); the Vietnam Era Twin Registry, Health Services Research and Development Program, Department of Veterans Affairs Hospital, Hines, Ill (Drs Goldberg and Ramakrishnan); the School of Public Health, St Louis University (Dr True), the Research Service, St Louis VAMC (Drs True and Eisen), the Division of General Medical Sciences, Department of Medicine, Washington University School of Medicine (Dr Eisen), St Louis, Mo; the Department of Psychology, Boston University (Dr Lyons), the Harvard Institute of Psychiatric Epidemiology and Genetics (Drs Lyons and Tsuang), the Harvard Medical School, Department of Psychiatry at Massachusetts Mental Health Center (Drs Lyons and Tsuang), Boston, Mass.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Am J Public Health 2000 Apr; 90(4):573-8 Related Articles, Links
Lifetime prevalence of suicide symptoms and affective disorders among men reporting same-sex sexual partners: results from NHANES III.

Cochran SD, Mays VM.
Department of Epidemiology, UCLA School of Public Health 90095-1772, USA. [email protected]

OBJECTIVES: This study examined lifetime prevalence of suicide symptoms and affective disorders among men reporting a history of same-sex sexual partners.

METHODS: In the third National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey, men aged 17 to 39 years were assessed for lifetime history of affective disorders and sexual behavior patterns. The study classified this subset of men into 3 groups: those reporting same-sex sexual partners, those reporting only female sexual partners, and those reporting no sexual partners. Groups were compared for histories of suicide symptoms and affective disorders.

RESULTS: A total of 2.2% (95% confidence interval [CI] = 1.3%, 3.1%) of men reported same-sex sexual partners. These men evidenced greater lifetime prevalence rates of suicide symptoms than men reporting only female partners. However, homosexually/bisexually experienced men were no more likely than exclusively heterosexual men to meet criteria for lifetime diagnosis of other affective disorders.

CONCLUSIONS: These data provide further evidence of an increased risk for suicide symptoms among homosexually experienced men. Results also hint at a small, increased risk of recurrent depression among gay men, with symptom onset occurring, on average, during early adolescence.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Am J Psychiatry. 2003 Mar; 160(3):541-6. Related Articles, Links
Sexual orientation and self-harm in men and women.

Skegg K, Nada-Raja S, Dickson N, Paul C, Williams S.
Department of Psychological Medicine, University of Otago Medical School, Dunedin, New Zealand. keren.[email protected]

OBJECTIVE: Recent studies of homosexual people have found higher rates of nonfatal suicidal behavior than among heterosexuals. The purpose of this study was to determine associations between self-harm and sexual orientation for men and women separately, defining sexual orientation by sexual attraction rather than by behavior.

METHOD: In a birth cohort of 1,019 New Zealand young adults eligible to be interviewed at age 26 years, 946 participated in assessments of both sexual attraction and self-harm.

RESULTS: Both women and men who had experienced same-sex attraction had higher risks of self-harm. The odds ratios for suicidal ideation in the past year were 3.1 for men and 2.9 for women. Odds ratios for ever having deliberately self-harmed were 5.5 for men and 1.9 for women. Men with same-sex attraction were also significantly more likely to report having attempted suicide. In both sexes, a greater degree of same-sex attraction predicted increasing likelihood of self-harm, with over one-third of men and women with persistent major same-sex attraction reporting this. Men with even a minor degree of same-sex attraction had high rates of self-harm and resulting physical injury. One-quarter of deliberate self-harm among men and one-sixth among women was potentially attributable to same-sex attraction.

CONCLUSIONS: This study provides evidence of a link between increasing degrees of same-sex attraction and self-harm in both men and women, with the possibility of some difference between the sexes that needs to be explored further.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> American Journal of Public Health December 2002.
RESEARCH AND PRACTICE

Battering Victimization Among a Probability-Based Sample of Men Who Have Sex With Men

Gregory L. Greenwood, PhD, MPH, Michael V. Relf, PhD, RN, Bu Huang, PhD, Lance M. Pollack, PhD, Jesse A. Canchola, MS and Joseph A. Catania, PhD Gregory L. Greenwood, Lance M. Pollack, Jesse A. Canchola, and Joseph A. Catania are with the Center for AIDS Prevention Studies, University of California, San Francisco. At the time of this study, Michael V. Relf was with Whitman-Walker Clinic, Washington, DC. Bu Huang is with the Prevention Research Center, School of Social Work, University of Washington, Seattle.

Correspondence: Requests for reprints should be sent to Gregory L. Greenwood, PhD, UCSF-CAPS, 74 New Montgomery St, Suite 600, San Francisco, CA 94105 (e-mail: [email protected]).

ABSTRACT OBJECTIVES: This study measured the prevalence of battering victimization (i.e., experience of psychological/symbolic, physical, and sexual battering) among men who have sex with men (MSM) and identified characteristics of these men.

METHODS: A probability-based sample of 2881 MSM living in 4 cities completed telephone interviews between 1996 and 1998.

RESULTS: Prevalence estimates were 34% for psychological/symbolic battering, 22% for physical battering, and 5% for sexual battering. The strongest demographic correlate independently associated with all forms of battering was age 40 or younger, whereas education and HIV serostatus were associated with physical and psychological/symbolic violence.

CONCLUSIONS. Rates of battering victimization among urban MSM are substantially higher than among heterosexual men and possibly heterosexual women. Public health efforts directed toward addressing intimate partner battering among these men are needed. This finding looks at the relationship between sexual orientation and relationship violence.

FINDING: Relationship violence was found to be a significant problem for homosexuals. Forty-four (44) percent of the gay men reported having experienced violence in their relationships; 13 percent reported sexual violence and 83 percent reported emotional abuse. Levels of abuse ran even higher among lesbians: 55 percent reported physical violence in their relationships, 14 percent reported sexual abuse, and 84 percent reported emotional abuse.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Sample or Data Description
499 ethnically diverse homosexual, bisexual, and transgendered teenagers and adults
Source
Susan C. Turrell

"A Descriptive Analysis of Same-Sex Relationship Violence for a Diverse Sample"
Journal of Family Violence.

Vol. 13, 2000. Page(s) 281-293.
Associated Keywords: Homosexuality, Spouse/Partner abuse, Violence, Sexual abuse
Finding ID: 3334
This finding looks at the relationship between homosexuality and relationship violence.

FINDING: Almost one-third (29.7 percent) of gays and nearly one-half (47.5 percent) of lesbians reported being or having been the victim of relationship violence. In addition, 22 percent of gays and 38 percent of lesbians admitted using violence against their partners.

<hr width="80%" align="center"> Sample or Data Description
283 gays and lesbians
Source
Lisa Walder-Haugrad, Linda Vaden Gratch, and Brian Magruder
"Victimization and Perpetration Rates of Violence in Gay and Lesbian Relationships: Gender Issues Explored"
Violence and Victims. Vol. 12, 1997. Page(s) 173-184.
Associated Keywords: Homosexuality, Spouse/Partner abuse, Violence, FindingID: 2690

Self-harm in homosexuals

946 young adults aged 26 in New Zealand
Homosexual men -- 3.1 times more likely to have suicidal ideation
Homosexual women -- 2.9 times more likely to have suicidal ideation

Homosexual men -- 5.5 times more likely to self-harm
Homosexual women -- 1.9 times more likely to self-harm


Skegg K. Am J Psychiatry. 2003 Mar; 160(3):541-6.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

The Problem of Pedophilia

<hr width="30%" align="center"> For many years, Western society has considered adult-child sex to be legally, socially, and morally taboo. Pedophiles have been judged criminal by the courts, sinful by theologians, and psychologically disordered by the mental-health profession.

Slowly, however, that situation has been changing.

A Fringe Element Begins to
Make Inroads into the Mainstream


NAMBLA--the North American Man-Boy Love Association--was once the lone voice lobbying for the normalization of pedophilia. NAMBLA representatives marched in gay-pride parades as a fringe element of the gay-rights movement.

Then in 1990, the Journal of Homosexuality produced a special double issue devoted to adult-child sex, which was entitled "Male Intergenerational Intimacy" (1). One article said many pedophiles believe they are "born that way and cannot change" (p. 133). Another writer said a man who counseled troubled teenage boys could achieve "miracles... not by preaching to them, but by sleeping with them." The loving pedophile can offer a "companionship, security and protection" which neither peers nor parents can provide (p. l62). Parents should look upon the pedophile who loves their son "not as a rival or competitor, not as a thief of their property, but as a partner in the boy's upbringing, someone to be welcomed into their home..." (p. 164).

A British university professor wrote: "Boys want sex with men, boys seduce adult men, the experience is very common and much enjoyed" (p. 323). A professor of social science at the State University of New York says he looks forward to the day when Americans will "get over their hysteria about child abuse" (p. 325) and child pornography.

A.P.A. Publishes a New Study:
Not All Pedophile Relationships are Harmful


The American Psychological Association did not denounce the positions advanced within the that journal. In fact, just recently, the A.P.A. published a new, major study (2) written by one of those same Journal of Homosexuality writers.

This latest article appears in the A.P.A.'s own prestigious Psychological Bulletin. It provides an overview of all the research studying the harm resulting from childhood sexual abuse.

The authors' conclusion? That childhood sexual abuse is on average, only slightly associated with psychological harm--and that the harm may not be due to the sexual experience, but to the negative family factors in the children's backgrounds. When the sexual contact is not coerced, especially when it is experienced by a boy and is remembered positively, it may not be harmful at all.

The authors of the article propose that psychologists stop using judgmental terms like "child abuse," "molestation," and "victims," using instead neutral, value-free terms like "adult-child sex." Similarly, they say we should not talk about the "the severity of the abuse," but instead refer to "the level of sexual intimacy."

The authors conclude that behavior which psychotherapists commonly term "abuse" may only constitute a violation of social norms. And science, they say, should separate itself from social-moral terminology. Religion and society, these writers argue, are free to judge behavior as they wish...but psychiatry should evaluate behavior by its own set of standards.

In fact, the authors of the Psychological Bulletin article propose what they consider may be a better way of understanding pedophilia: that it may only be "abuse" if the child feels bad about the relationship. They are in effect suggesting a repetition of the steps by which homosexuality was normalized. In its first step toward removing homosexuality from the Diagnostic Manual, the A.P.A. said the condition was normal as long as the person did not feel bad about it.

Few laymen are aware that the American Psychiatric Association recently redefined the criteria for pedophilia. According to the latest diagnostic manual (DSM--IV), a person no longer has a psychological disorder simply because he molests children. To be diagnosed as disordered, now he must also feel anxious about the molestation, or be impaired in his work or social relationships. Thus the A.P.A. has left room for the "psychologically normal" pedophile.

Theology and the Law Are Led By Psychology

If psychology indeed recognizes consensual pedophilia as harmless, then civil law and social norms will be under pressure to follow the lead of social science...as indeed they did on the issue of homosexuality. When psychiatry declared homosexuality normal, our courts and theologians began to re-write both civil law and moral theology based on what psychiatry said it had discovered through the medium of empirical science.

But What is a Psychological Disorder?

The problem with the law and society being a follower of psychology, is that what is categorized as a "psychological illness" depends on psychiatry's view of the good life, and of human nature. And today, there is grave disagreement on those subjects.

So when psychiatry decided to redefine homosexuality as normal, it moved the condition from one category labeled "undesirable" to another category labeled "desirable." (4) It did so based on a study showing that a selected group of homosexual individuals evidenced no obvious psychological abnormality (5), and also as a result of listening to personal testimony from a number of gay people who were happy with their homosexuality. In essence, these individuals said, "We aren't psychologically unbalanced or distressed, and we're happy being gay ...So psychiatry has no right to label us disordered."

Psychology Yields to the Authority of Personal Experience

The A.P.A. agreed with them. In doing so, it surrendered its authority to contradict personal experience. At the same time, it chose to ignore a vast body of literature on unconscious motivation and established personality theory. It also relinquished the age-old conviction that human beings are governed by certain immutable laws of nature relating to male-female psychological and physical complementarity.

As psychiatry becomes detached from its foundations, we hear more opinions such as these--expressed by world-renowned, Professor Emeritus (Johns Hopkins U.) sexologist Dr. John Money:
"If I were to see the case of a boy aged ten or eleven who's intensely erotically attracted toward a man in his twenties or thirties, if the relationship is totally mutual, and the bonding is genuinely totally mutual...then I would not call it pathological in any way" (6)​
And so we can see that a door has been opened.

Psychiatrist Jeffrey Satinover reflects on the Journal of Homosexuality's "Male Intergenerational Intimacy":
"This special issue reflects the substantial, influential, and growing segment of the homosexual community that neither hides nor condemns pedophilia. Rather they argue that pedophilia is an acceptable aspect of sexuality, especially of homosexuality. Indeed, the San Francisco Sentinel, a Bay Area gay-activist newspaper, published a piece arguing that pedophilia is central to male homosexual life" (7).​
Gay advocates correctly state that most child molesters are heterosexual males. However, this is a misleading statement, since most males are heterosexual.

In proportion to their numbers (about 1 out of 36 men), homosexual males may be more likely to engage in sex with minors: in fact, some research suggests a possible 3-to-one ratio (8). However, research in this area is not conclusive because the sexual orientation of male-on-male abusers was not always clear (some abusers are bisexuals).
These statistics do not, of course, take into account the cases of homosexual child abuse which are unreported. NARTH's Executive Director Dr. Joseph Nicolosi, for example, says that about one-third of his 400 adult homosexual clients said they had experienced some form of homosexual abuse before the age of consent, but only two of those cases had been reported to legal authorities.

While no more than 2% of male adults are homosexual, some studies indicate that approximately 35% of pedophiles are homosexual (9). :puking:

Further, since male-on-male pedophiles victimize far more children than do heterosexual pedophiles (10), it is estimated that approximately 80% of pedophilic victims are boys who have been molested by adult males (11).

Homosexual Men were Often Childhood Victims

Dr. Nicolosi says that many of his clients' childhood sexual contacts occurred with a trusted older person, and were perceived at the time of the abuse as loving. Other sexual-reorientation therapists report similar high rates of molestation among their clients (12, 13).

Tragically, the abused child is then more likely to become an abuser in adulthood (14). Thus, it would not be surprising that pedophilia could be more common among homosexual men: since they are more likely to have been victims of abuse themselves, they would also be more likely to initiate a repetition of that abuse with a same-sex child.

Which Child is Most Likely to Become a Victim?

Certain children are especially vulnerable to abuse--especially the boy who is predisposed to homosexuality. The prehomosexual boy is very often lonely, alienated from his father, and experiencing frustrating and deficient same-sex peer relationships. He quite naturally craves male attention, affection and approval.

Often the same boy is also experiencing an overly intense and intimate relationship with his mother, which makes normal masculine individuation difficult. An intimate relationship with a man is one place of separation and individuation "where Mother cannot go" (15).

When this lonely boy receives flattering attention from an older male, then a link is established between love and homoerotic sex. The boy comes to believe, "If I want love from men, I must have sex with them." Thus the normal and natural developmental need of same-sex love and approval has become eroticized. The boy may then develop a compulsive, promiscous sexual habit pattern, which in gay life is seen fairly frequently.

Many Gay Biographies Tell the Story

In his life story, Breaking the Surface, Olympic diver Greg Louganis tells the poignant tale of his own experience with adult-child sex. He was an unusually sensitive boy, with an intense closeness with his mother, and a distant, fearful relationship with his father. Lonely and starving for male affection, he was molested by an older man he encountered on the beach. In his childish neediness, Louganis--like many victims of man-boy molestation--perceived that relationship as loving.

Who is Likely to be an Abuser?

Psychoanalysis recognizes the child abuser as typically an immature man who wants to "give love" to a boy which he did not himself receive in childhood. He makes a narcissistic identification with the child, seeing him as an idealized version of himself, and perceives himself as giving the same love which he wishes he had received from his own father. Thus the pedophile cannot understand that he is inflicting emotional damage.

Gay Fiction Presents Pedophilic
Relationships Positively


Popular gay and lesbian fiction often portrays adult-child sexual relationships as fondly remembered, tender "coming-of-age" stories. Much of this fiction is clearly pornographic--is aimed specifically at teenagers--and is recommended to them on reading lists distributed by gay-advocacy groups such as P-FLAG (Parents and Friends of Lesbians and Gays) (16), or offered to them in some public-school libraries (17).

What is the Harm of Childhood Seduction?

Dutch psychologist Gerard van den Aardweg points out that "non-coerced" sex is a misnomer because there is always an element of coercion -- involving a misuse of adult authority, and a misuse of the child's need for affection. If a researcher sees no harm, "it may be because he is using the wrong glasses...not because there is nothing to see." Even adult-child sex which is mutually enjoyed, he says, is always an intrinsic injustice to the integrity of the person (18).

Dr. David Finkelhor, a leading U.S. researcher in the field of child sexual abuse, similarly disputes the conclusions of pedophile advocates.

He describes some of the consequences of childhood seduction: confusion about sexual identity and sexual norms; inability to differentiate sex from love; confusion between care-getting and care-giving, with lowered respect for adult authority; guilt, shame, anxiety, lowered self-esteem, depression, vulnerability to drug and alcohol abuse, and impaired ability to judge the trustworthiness of others. We also see an age-inappropriate sexual knowledge, and sex acts sometimes compulsively reenacted with other children (19).

Victims of sex abuse also appear to be at higher risk for suicide (20), and may repeat the sexual abuse in adulthood, in order to gain a feeling of psychological mastery over the experience (21). Children who experience prolonged abuse are more likely to view the abuse as positive or neutral, suggesting that as the molestation continues, children eventually identify with the molester (22).

If the abuse was homosexual, the boy is likely to question his sexual orientation; if the abuser was a male and the child a girl, she may defensively turn to lesbianism (23).

But even if pedophile advocates proved to be right that children don't often suffer psychological damage in adulthood (and Dr. Finkelhor believes they're wrong), the impact of pedophilia must not be judged simply on the basis of empirical findings.

"Ultimately," says Dr. Finkelhor, "I do continue to believe that the prohibition on adult-child sexual contact is primarily a moral issue. While empirical findings have some relevance, they are not [to be] the final arbiter."

Some slaves, he says, experienced slavery as good; likewise, many child sweatshop workers said their work was beneficial. Despite this, we know better than to conclude that either slavery or child labor are ultimately good, he argues.

Similarly, research reveals that the birth of children is correlated with a drop in marital satisfaction for several years. Yet in spite of that empirical evidence, we do not declare childrearing to be "bad for marriage." We know that psychological distress, or the lack of it, only gives us a partial understanding of any particular life issue.

Dr. Finkelhor concludes: "Some types of social relationships violate deeply held values and principles in our culture about equality and self-determination. Sex between children and adults is one of them. Evidence that some children have positive experiences does not challenge these values" (24).

Endnotes

1. The Journal of Homosexuality, "Male Intergenerational Intimacy: Historical, Socio-Psychological, and Legal Perspectives," vol. 20, Nos. 1&2, 1990. This back issue can be ordered by calling 1-800-HAWORTH.
2. Rind, Bruce, Tromovitch, Philip, and Bauserman, Robert. (Temple U. Dept. of Psychology, Phila., PA)., A Meta-analytic Examination of Assumed Properties of Child Sexual Abuse Using College Samples. Psychological Bulletin, 1998 (July), vol. 124 (1), 22-53.
3. Pedophilia Not Always a Disorder? NARTH Bulletin, April 1995, page 1.
4. Satinover, Jeffrey (1996). Homosexuality and the Politics of Truth. Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books. P. 43.
5. Hooker, Evelyn, The Adjustment of the Male Overt Homosexual, Journal of Projective Techniques, 1957, 21, 1831.
6. Interview: John Money. PAIDIKA: The Journal of Paedophilia, Spring 1991, vol. 2, no. 3, p. 5.
7. Satinover, Jeffrey (1996). Homosexuality and the Politics of Truth. Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books, p. 63.
8. Freund, K. and R. I. Watson, The Proportions of Heterosexual and Homosexual Pedophiles Among Sex Offenders Against Children: An Exploratory Study, Journal of Sex and Marital Therapy 18 (Spring 1992): 3443.
9. K. Freund et al., Pedophilia and Heterosexuality vs. Homosexuality, Journal of Sex and Marital Therapy 10 (Fall 1984): 197.
10. Freund, K. and R. I. Watson, The Proportions of Heterosexual and Homosexual Pedophiles Among Sex Offenders Against Children: An Exploratory Study, Journal of Sex and Marital Therapy 18 (Spring 1992): 3443.
11. Schmidt, Thomas (1995). Straight and Narrow? Compassion and Clarity in the Homosexuality Debate. Downers Grove, Ill.: Intervarsity Press, p. 114.
12. Byrd, A. Dean. Integrating Treatment of Unwanted Male Homosexual Attractions: Clinical Interventions. Paper presented at the NARTH Annual Conference, October 23, 1998, Los Angeles, Ca.
13. Dickson, Gregory, An Empirical Study of the MotherSon Dyad in Relation to the Development of Adult Male Homosexuality: An Object Relations Perspective, doctoral dissertation available through UMI, 300North Zeeb Road, Ann Arbor, MI 48106-1346.
14. Siegel, J., Sorenson, S., Golding, J., Burnam, J., Stein, J., The prevalence of childhood sexual assault: the Los Angeles epidemiological catchment area project. American Journal of Epidemiology 126,6:1141.
15. Dickson, Gregory, An Empirical Study of the MotherSon Dyad in Relation to the Development of Adult Male Homosexuality: An Object Relations Perspective, 1998.
16. "Be Yourself: Questions and Answers for Gay, Lesbian and Bisexual Youth," published by Parents and Friends of Lesbians and Gays, 1101 14<sup>th</sup> Street, N.W., Suite 1030, Washington, DC 20005.
17. "Action Group Forms in Seattle," by Eleanor Durham, Parents and Teachers for Responsible Schools, P.O. Box 28519, Seattle, Washington 98118-8519, from the NARTH Bulletin, April 1998, p. 11.
18. Van den Aardweg, Gerard, (The Netherlands), private correspondence to NARTH, October 26, 1998.
19. Finkelhor, David, et al (1986). A Sourcebook on Child Sexual Abuse. Newbury Park, CA: Sage Publications.
20. Beitchman, J., Zucker, K., Hood, J., DaCosta, G., Akman, D. (1991) A Review of the Short-Term Effects of Child Sexual Abuse. Child Abuse and Neglect 15:537-556.
21. Rekers, George (1995). Handbook of Child and Adolescent Sexual Problems. N.Y.: Lexington Books, p. 158.
22. Doll, L., Joy, D., Bartholow, B., Harrison, J., Bolan, G., Douglas, J., Saltzman, L., Moss, P., Delgado, W. (1992), Self-reported childhood and adolescent sexual abuse among adult homosexual and bisexual men. Child Abuse and Neglect 16:825-864.
23. Engel, B. (1982) The Right to Innocence. Los Angeles, CA: Jeremy P. Tarcher, p. 193.
24. Finkelhor, David, "Response to Bauserman," Journal of Homosexuality, vol. 20, Nos. 1&2, 1990, pp. 314-315.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Good to see ya reaching into your voluminous collection of articles discussing your personal fascination with pedophilia, Mark.

But please keep it in your mind and don't act on it.

Not sure what the penalties are for a Canadian like you, but here in the USA, the authorities frown on guys your age working down minor age children.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Good to see ya reaching into your voluminous collection of articles discussing your personal fascination with pedophilia, Mark.

But please keep it in your mind and don't act on it.

Not sure what the penalties are for a Canadian like you, but here in the USA, the authorities frown on guys your age working down minor age children.
Why do you take psychedelic drugs, Steve?

Why do you write bad checks, mow lawns and peddle Amway junk to pay for those psychedelic drugs, Steve?

Why do you talk to dead people, Steve?

Why are you a member of multiple cults, Steve?

Why are you a militant sodomite activist, Steve?

Why do you have a cyber mancrush on me, Steve?
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Quit flirting, Mark.

You reduce your ability to "change minds" via your politics posts in a sports handicapping web forum when you burn unneccesary minutes flirting with me, a flaming heterosexual.

Now get back to work and find more copy/paste jobs detailing your fascination with homos and pedos.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Why do you take psychedelic drugs, Steve?

Why do you write bad checks, mow lawns and peddle Amway junk to pay for those psychedelic drugs, Steve?

Why do you talk to dead people, Steve?

Why are you a member of multiple cults, Steve?

Why are you a militant sodomite activist, Steve?

Why do you have a cyber mancrush on me, Steve?
^^^^ Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you Doc Mercer ^^^^^

the right wing, Canadian homosexual Doc Mercer, that is.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

heh...

With Mercer gone, if I were not here to tweak on "joe's" hyperbolic posts, he'd be almost all alone.

I can't let that happen. Dudes with bipolar brains get really edgy when they're all alone, in the middle of the night....pacing around an otherwise empty one bedroom apartment.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

heh...

With Mercer gone, if I were not here to tweak on "joe's" hyperbolic posts, he'd be almost all alone.

I can't let that happen. Dudes with bipolar brains get really edgy when they're all alone, in the middle of the night....pacing around an otherwise empty one bedroom apartment.......IN MISSISSAUGA???????????????? OR BRAMPTON????????????????
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Gay rights campaigner led a double life as leader of paedophile ring that carried out a catalogue of child abuse

By Daily Mail Reporter
Last updated at 11:57 AM on 08th May 2009

A paedophile ring has been smashed after eight men were found guilty of a horrifying catalogue of more than 50 child pornography and abuse charges.

Among the crimes was a shocking sexual attack carried out on a three-month-old baby boy by an executive adviser on child sex issues.

James Rennie, chief executive of a publicly-funded gay rights group, was one of the men exposed yesterday as members of Scotland's biggest paedophile ring.

Enlarge


Rennie, 38, molested the toddler son of unsuspecting friends - a little boy he had been trusted to babysit - recording the abuse and sharing it with other perverts.


In the course of the police investigation, the boy's parents were forced to watch a video of their baby son being violated by Rennie.

Last night, after the eight men were found guilty of a string of child sex charges at the High Court in Edinburgh, the child's parents reacted with disgust.

They said: 'For over 15 years, James Rennie seemed the closest of family friends and it is hard to put into words the extent of the betrayal he has exacted upon us.'

During their investigations, police recovered tens of thousands of still and moving images of the most vile child abuse.

Enlarge


Police sources revealed yesterday that the activities of 70 other men around the UK with links to the case are being investigated.

More than 35 people have been arrested or been subject to enforcement action. Two investigations are continuing in Scotland.

One of the most worrying aspects of the case is the way Rennie was able to reach a position where he could influence Executive policy on child sexuality.

A trained teacher, Rennie became the boss of LGBT Youth Scotland, a publicly-funded support group for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender young people.
2938u4ji23

He took on the ?40,000 a year role when the group was set up in 2003 and became the Executive's most important and influential adviser on gay issues affecting children.

Under his leadership, the group backed proposals to allow gay adoption.
As well as appearing in the Scottish parliament, he was invited to a Royal Garden Party and to Downing Street.



Yesterday, Rennie, from Edinburgh, was found guilty of indecently abusing the baby boy. The abuse began when the child was three months old and continued for several years. Rennie filmed and photographed himself committing the abuse, sent the images to others and allowed another man to listen on the phone while he molested the child.

He allowed the boy, whom he called his 'nephew', to be abused by another paedophile and also offered him to other deviants in a series of emails.

When his home was raided in December 2007, Rennie had gone to the trouble of hiding computer hard drives, discs and CDs in a gap next to the water tank in his kitchen.

Between these storage devices and his laptop computer, he was found to be in possession of thousands of images, many of them at the most extreme level of the scale.

Rennie carried out his vile activities as part of a Scottish paedophile ring swapping images of child pornography on the internet.



He was suspended as soon as LGBT Youth Scotland was told of his arrest in December 2007 and resigned soon afterwards.

Last night, a spokesman for LGBT Youth Scotland, which received ?1.1million in 2008 from the Executive, councils and health boards, said: 'We are appalled by the abuse and exploitation of children by James Rennie, and wholeheartedly welcome his conviction. Our immediate thoughts are with the children and families who have been directly, and indirectly, abused by him and the other co-accused also convicted.

'We had no suspicion whatsoever of the crimes James Rennie was committing. He was obviously skilled at hiding his actions and adept at deceiving people. There is no suggestion James Rennie directly threatened the safety of young people accessing our services.'

Last night the Executive said that it would continue to fund LGBT. :doh1

When he was arrested, Rennie had a steady boyfriend, but trawled the internet looking for gay sex dates.

He also used the internet to meet other paedophiles, including Neil Strachan, a child molester who was jailed for three years at Edinburgh Sheriff Court in 1997 for abusing a boy of between five and seven.

Strachan, 41, joined Rennie for a sex session with Rennie's 'nephew' at his flat in Meadowbank when the boy was between one and three.

Rennie then boasted about the encounter to another paedophile, Lachlan Anderson, 51, from Cumbernauld, Dunbartonshire. Anderson is currently serving a 20-month sentence after being caught with a collection of child pornography, including images of Rennie abusing the child. He was brought from jail to give evidence at the trial.

Strachan was found guilty of attempting to sodomise a different 18-month-old toddler on the night of Hogmanay 2005 at his flat in the Dalry area of Edinburgh.

Last night, the boy's mother said: ' The anguish I feel towards Mr Strachan is indescribable.

'I feel that no matter what punishment is given to Mr Strachan it will never be able to compensate for the hurt, devastation and great deal of stress brought to me and my family.

'Mr Strachan used and abused our trust in order to satisfy his and others' sick needs.'

Strachan's 23-year-old boyfriend Colin Slaven was cleared of taking part in the sex act, which was photographed and sent to Rennie.

Rennie involved John Milligan, 40, in his sick acts by allowing him to listen to the baby boy being abused.

Milligan also discussed getting his hands on the child - and passed on images of Rennie's abuse to others.

The paedophile ring was uncovered when photos of naked boys were found on Strachan's computer. He handed it in for repair at a company in England in 2007.

A computer engineer found one indecent image of a child on the machine and police were called in.

An examination by Northumbria Police revealed other images.

The inquiry moved to Edinburgh, where Operation Algebra was set up in October 2007 by Lothian and Borders Police.

Detective Superintendent Allan Jones, senior investigating officer in Operation Algebra, said of the men: 'Many of them wouldn't stand out from a general member of the public; but in the background they lead this double life, looking at some of the most vile material you would ever care to imagine.

'Quite what motivates them and why they take this course of action I really don't know. What I do know is we can't be forgiving of it and we've got to pursue it to the nth degree to make sure that this material is stopped.'

A jury found Rennie, Strachan, Milligan, Ross Webber, 27, and Craig Boath, 24, guilty of plotting to arrange access to children to carry out acts of gross sexual abuse. It is the first time a conspiracy charge has been used successfully in Scotland to convict perverts.

Church bell ringer Neil Campbell, 46, was cleared of that charge. But all six, along with Slaven and John Murphy, 44, were found guilty of charges relating to child pornography.

Having been convicted of actual physical abuse of children, Rennie and Strachan face a possible life sentence.

Prosecutor Dorothy Bain, QC, asked for 'a full risk assessment' which would allow the court to impose an order for lifelong restriction - under which a judge imposes a minimum sentence but the accused are only freed when the parole board considers it safe to do so.

They then remain under strict supervision for the rest of their lives.

Judge Lord Bannatyne said: 'I am going to go down that route and investigate an order for lifelong restriction for both these accused.'

All eight men were remanded in custody to await sentence.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Wow, gay men involved in pedophilia? Who knew?

I mean, the militant sodomites keep telling us it is "natural" to be gay, right?

FACT: Homosexuality and pedophilia are inextricably linked.

Betcha Andrew Sullivan has child porn on his computer.

 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

It seems Manny is right on the money. Joey does have some sort of fixation on kiddie sex crimes and gay men. . .
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

It seems Manny is right on the money. Joey does have some sort of fixation on kiddie sex crimes and gay men. . .
I speak the truth -- while the EOG's perverts keep trying to legitimize and normalize a vile, devious act by posting idiotic articles on gay penguins...

 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Some zany smiley faces and multi-colored fonts would really add some pizzazz to the comedy show here. . .
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Homosexuality/pedophilia is "comedy"? :blink:

I don't understand why society has permitted all this to happen. (Okay, maybe I do...)

The media, academia, the clergy, libraries, and the teaching profession were slowly but purposefully infiltrated by the militant sodomite agenda, starting about 40 years ago.

The vast majority understand right from wrong -- yet are afraid to be labeled narrow-minded or parochial.

And so society permits this demonic activity because all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.

Modern gay culture is an abomination -- a dark chapter in human history.

The idea that society now encourages kids to be gay is a sentence to eternal darkness, disease and death.

The Word of God doesn't mince words exposing this evil perversion -- and we shouldn't either.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

This is what we like to call a canard perpetuated by the right to keep 'real' issues from being explored and worked on. God created homosexuality right alongside everything else. God only cares about us being nice and this is where Republicans fail and fail miserably.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Well fellas, there we have it. Yet another thumbnail shot of the brain of Mark L**uel in Toronto Canada.

18 hours of busy posts replete with giant phunny photos, dancing and puking smileys, a pathetic marking out to the Alaska's Biggest Loser and of course numerous posts pulled from his voluminus computer files and bookmarked sites dealing with homosexuals and kiddie bangers.

And some people still wonder why "joeC" can't establish a healthy relationship with a real live woman even as he enters his 30s.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

This is what we like to call a canard perpetuated by the right to keep 'real' issues from being explored and worked on. God created homosexuality right alongside everything else. God only cares about us being nice and this is where Republicans fail and fail miserably.
Are you serious? :doh1

Which God do you believe in?

The same perverted little voice Steve Heath takes his cues from every time he fries millions brain cells snorting/inhaling/shooting up psychedelic drugs?

:bwah:

Lev. 18:22, "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination."1

Lev. 20:13
, "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltness is upon them"

1 Cor. 6:9-10
, "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, <sup>10</sup>nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

Rom. 1:26-28
, "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, <sup>27</sup>and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. <sup>28</sup>And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."
Sorry ZZ, the Bible is unequivocal in it's condemnation of this sick, vile, deviant behavior.

Here's another one of my favorites:

"Woe to those who call evil good,
and good evil;
Who put darkness for light,
and light for darkness....
Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes,
And prudent in their own sight!"
Isaiah 5:2-21


Woe onto those touchy-feely leftists who practice and preach moral relativism.

If not in this lifetime, then absolutely the next. :thumbsup

 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Thankfully, we here in the United States are not governed by some dude's interpretation of one of the religious books. Rather, the magnificent Constitution is our bedrock document; the text is readily available online, even for foreigners. . .Next. . .
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Thankfully, we here in the United States are not governed by some dude's interpretation of one of the religious books. Rather, the magnificent Constitution is our bedrock document;
And the Constitution and original spirit of the Founders was inspired by which set of values? Here's a hint:



Next. . .
Indeed.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Dunno about up in "JoeC's" native country of Canada, but in my hoods, there's a word for guys who have reached 30 years old and who are never seen in the company of a real live adult female.

And it's not "sodomite".

It's Nancy.

Mayhaps we should make that Markie's new gloss.

Nancy Contrarian

got a nice ring to it
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Are you serious? :doh1

Which God do you believe in?

The same perverted little voice Steve Heath takes his cues from every time he fries millions brain cells snorting/inhaling/shooting up psychedelic drugs?

:bwah:



Sorry ZZ, the Bible is unequivocal in it's condemnation of this sick, vile, deviant behavior.

Here's another one of my favorites:

"Woe to those who call evil good,

and good evil;


Who put darkness for light,


and light for darkness....


Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes,


And prudent in their own sight!"


Isaiah 5:2-21



Woe onto those touchy-feely leftists who practice and preach moral relativism.

If not in this lifetime, then absolutely the next. :thumbsup​


Jesus loved everybody, not just heterosexuals. Jesus is nice! You, Joe should learn from Jesus and his teachings of love and forgiveness, as we all should learn. Good luck Joe, I think you're gonna need it.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Jesus loved everybody, not just heterosexuals. Jesus is nice! You, Joe should learn from Jesus and his teachings of love and forgiveness, as we all should learn. Good luck Joe, I think you're gonna need it.
Do you have a Biblical verse to back up your touchy-feely leftist drivel?

Jesus hated this putrid sinful lifestyle even more than I do:

1 Cor. 6:9-10
, "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, <sup>10</sup>nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

Rom. 1:26-28
, "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, <sup>27</sup>and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. <sup>28</sup>And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."

Translation: There's no "gay pride" in heaven. If you're a defiant sodomite, don't bother asking for forgiveness. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. Into Lucifer's dungeon you go. :thumbsup

As a civilized society, we will pay a very heavy price if we continue to defy the will of God.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Study: Childhood Sexual Abuse Often a Factor in Sexual Disorientation

By Bob Ellis on July 7th, 2009
Last week when I discussed the case of Frank Lombard, Associate director of Duke University’s Center for Health Policy, who molested his adopted 5-year-old son and offered his son to other homosexuals for molestation, I also touched on the higher molestation rates of children by homosexuals.

Judith Reisman, president of the Institute for Media Education, cites this research, as does a study by Dr. Gene Abel, director of the Behavioral Medicine Institute in Atlanta, which found that homosexuals sexually molest young boys with an incidence five times greater than the molestation rate of girls. Dr. Able’s study also found that 150 boys are molested by one male homosexual offender, compared to 19.8 girls by heterosexual offenders.

I also mentioned that homosexual men have been molested as children at much higher rates than heterosexual men (35% versus 4% in one study).

One of many important aspects of this finding is that, while childhood abuse does not automatically mean the child will grow up to perpetuate the abuse, it has been long known that most molesters were in fact molested themselves as children. Obviously it is a terrible cycle that should be broken where ever possible.

The folks from NAM and AidsMap in London published an article last week which examined the connection between childhood sexual abuse and adulthood risky sex and AIDS transmission:
The study lasted for four years and included a total of 4244 men. These men were recruited to the study in six US cities. All had recently had anal sex with another man, and all the men were HIV-negative at baseline. The men were randomised to receive a behavioural HIV prevention intervention or standard HIV prevention counselling. Every six months they were tested for HIV and provided details about their recent sexual behaviour.
To ascertain if an individual had a history of childhood sexual abuse they were asked on entry to the study to say if they had had a sexual experience before the age of 13 with an individual five years or more older than themselves; and/or if they had a sexual experience between the ages of 13 and 17 with an individual who was ten or more years older.

Of the 4244 individuals in the study, 1686 (40%) reported childhood sexual abuse. There were 258 HIV infections during the course of the study, a rate of 2.1 per 100 person years.
Notice that all of the individuals in this study were practicing homosexual men. Of the 4,244 homosexual men in this study 40% of them reported childhood sexual abuse. And as this relates to AIDS transmission, we are reminded of the startling statistics from the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) regarding AIDS transmission: 72% of male AIDS cases are associated with homosexual conduct. :doh1

While the incidence of risky behavior and AIDS transmission is interesting and seems indicative of the mental health issues associated with victims of molestation, it is ultimately the percentage of homosexual men who report childhood sexual abuse.

The causes of homosexual behavior are complicated and the subject of considerable debate. This debate is made all the more convoluted by the propaganda thrown about by homosexual activists and their apologists who would have us believe that an immoral and unnatural sexual behavior is completely normal and legitimate.

But before the world of clinical science became so confused with politically correct misinformation, indications were that homosexual behavior often resulted from childhood molestation, relational issues with a mother or father or both, and similar circumstances. We have historically seen that for homosexual men, childhood sexual trauma is a very common factor , and for homosexual women, childhood sexual trauma is almost universal, though sometimes later sexual trauma can be a factor.

Essentially, the evidence is strong that homosexuality is not a “sexual orientation” as homosexual activists want us to believe, but rather a “sexual disorientation.”

What does it mean to be disoriented? The dictionary defines it as “to cause to lose bearings : displace from normal position or relationship b: to cause to lose the sense of time, place, or identity.”

When we are driving or flying or walking in the woods and we become disoriented, we enter a state in which we are unsure about where we are, where we should be going, and how to get there.

Since we need only look at our body’s sex organs to tell quite obviously that we were created to function heterosexually (not to mention that only 2.9% of the population is homosexual), it becomes quite clear that any orientation other than heterosexual is a disorientation.

It seems more than fair to say that, due to childhood sexual trauma, relational problems with one or more parent, or some other issue, the person has become disoriented about their sexuality.

As anyone who has become disoriented knows, one can become re-oriented with some effort and frequently some help from others.

There are those who, for whatever reason, come to enjoy disorientation.

When someone drinks to excess or takes strong drugs, these have a disorienting effect, often leaving a person unsteady on their feet, not in firm command of their surroundings and how they should be acting. Often people come to like this state of disorientation, seeking to maintain that state by frequent indulgence in intoxicating substances. They, too, often need help in realizing the dangers of remaining in this disoriented state.

The similarities between a physically disoriented person and a sexually disoriented person (i.e. one not correctly oriented to their obviously heterosexual purpose) are quite striking when you think about it.

When homosexuals sometimes say they were created that way, that their “sexual orientation” is homosexual, they are incorrect. One who insists their proper orientation is homosexual is akin to the drunk who says with slurred speech, “I’m not drrunk.” Their orientation is obviously heterosexual (their bodies tell us that), but they have become disoriented as to their true nature and purpose.

And like any disoriented person, they can change. If they really want to.

So don’t be fooled by this deception. Help them by insisting on the truth and pointing those who are disoriented toward that truth. It is to their ultimate benefit, and to those around them.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Looks like the voters of Iowa will be giving the Supreme Court the same message California voters gave their kangaroos in black robes.

Question: What the hell is wrong with that 27%?


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Poll: 67 percent of Iowa voters want marriage amendment on ballot


<!-- start of photo frame --> <!-- end of photo frame --> Posted on Jul 14, 2009 | by Michael Foust DES MOINES, Iowa (BP)

In the first statewide survey since the Iowa Supreme Court's landmark "gay marriage" ruling, a new poll shows that just over two-thirds of the state's voters support placing a constitutional marriage amendment on the ballot.

The survey of 500 registered voters by Voter/Consumer Research was released Monday, more than three months after the court made the state the first in the heartland to recognize "marriages" between homosexuals.

The proposed marriage amendment -- proposed immediately after the ruling by state legislative Republicans but blocked by Democratic leaders -- likely will be an issue in next year's gubernatorial and General Assembly races. One candidate for the GOP nomination, Bob Vander Plaats, has pledged to make it a central theme of his campaign.

In the poll, 67 percent of voters support placing an amendment on the ballot while 27 percent believe the issue of "gay marriage" is best decided by the state Supreme Court.

The poll asked, "The Iowa Supreme Court has ruled gay marriages can legally be conducted in the state. Whether you agree or disagree with the decision, do you think Iowa voters should have the chance to vote on a traditional marriage amendment to the constitution or is the issue best decided by the Supreme Court?"

The survey was conducted for TheIowaRepublican.com website. Among Republicans surveyed, 87 percent favor putting the amendment on the ballot.

Bryan English, a spokesman for the Iowa Family Policy Center, told the website that the poll numbers should open eyes.

"Public opinion on marriage is consistently a 65-70 percent issue, and the numbers tell us that Iowans want the right to vote on the Iowa Marriage Amendment," he said. "How the political class responds to these numbers will help separate the wheat from the chaff among those who seek office in 2010." :thumbsup

--30--
Michael Foust is an assistant editor of Baptist Press. To read how "gay marriage" impacts parental rights and religious freedom click here.
 

tank

EOG Dedicated
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Do you have a Biblical verse to back up your touchy-feely leftist drivel?

Jesus hated this putrid sinful lifestyle even more than I do:

1 Cor. 6:9-10
, "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, <sup>10</sup>nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

Rom. 1:26-28
, "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, <sup>27</sup>and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. <sup>28</sup>And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."

Translation: There's no "gay pride" in heaven. If you're a defiant sodomite, don't bother asking for forgiveness. Do not pass go, do not collect $200. Into Lucifer's dungeon you go. :thumbsup

As a civilized society, we will pay a very heavy price if we continue to defy the will of God.
Not answering for ZZ here Joe but i think he is referring to ''love the sinner but hate the sin''
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Haha. . .He said "Iowa". . . .As if. . . .You can't make this stuff up. . .
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Never gets old watching "joeC" - a non-Christian - cite New Testament verses to prop up his bigotry.

What's steadfastly ignored by our Toronto Tuffy is that we don't even know for sure if Jesus Christ himself was heterosexual.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

As Chef from SouthPark would say, "Here's a little song to help explain it"

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/neH6h0fXqlk&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/neH6h0fXqlk&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Now "joe" being a non-Christian might also explain why he cites New Testament verses supposedly written by Paul the Apostle and then alleges they provide evidence that "Jesus hates homosexuals".

And fornicators (people who have sex outside of marriage), adulterers (married people who have sex outside of marriage), drunkards (people who use alcohol like "Joe" did at the RxBash in 2007), thieves (people who have stolen) and a bunch more people who - according to Joe's twisted interpretation of the New Testament - are all "hated by Jesus".

I'm pretty sure there's some serious Hate going on here, but I'm kinda thinking that Jesus Christ has no involvement.
 
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Sometimes Spraying and Wiping Isn't Enough!

Call A Baptist Pastor Immediately If You've Experienced The Following Secret Invitation









 

scrimmage

What you contemplate you imitate
Re: Society must choose: The Sodomites or Judeo-Christian Tradition

Some of the moralizers here may appreciate Mr. Fish's depiction of a "Dick" they admire:

By NYCartist, July 15 at 6:33 pm
Why does anyone name their child Richard, which ends
up being ?Dick?, the penis joke/epithet?

Dick Head
Posted on Jul 14, 2009
By Mr.Fish

Cartoon,comment from:
http://www.truthdig.com/cartoon/item/20090714_dick_head/
This is such an evergreen thread thanks to all the contributors keeping it going who're:
"Thick as a Brick "-
Jethro Tull -
Madison Square Garden 1978
<EMBED src=http://www.youtube.com/v/toHlMD50eYY&hl=en&fs=1& width=425 height=344 type=application/x-shockwave-flash allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></EMBED>

 
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